Speakup installation

Speakup installation

[Ghoston, Ameenah]

Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
Please, clarify!
 
 

Ameenah A. Ghoston
Access Technology Specialist
National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
1800 Johnson St.
Baltimore, Md. 21230
Phone 410-659-9314-2414
email: aghoston@nfb.org 

 

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

Well, these are recommendations. In my experience people don't always
follow recommendations.

So, the consequences are doubtless irrelevant if one choses
"Everything." While I haven't tested for it, I would expect an
"everything" installation would render the class selection dialog
irrelevant.

However, if someone does not choose "everything," or misses that screen
for some reason, the Server Class selection will stillprovide the best,
and most completely configured set of applications for console use. I
guess we have found blind users of Linux most closely resemble sys
admins in general.


Ghoston, Ameenah writes:
> Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> Please, clarify!
>  
>  
> 
> Ameenah A. Ghoston
> Access Technology Specialist
> National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> 1800 Johnson St.
> Baltimore, Md. 21230
> Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> 
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.

I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
deciding Fedora is the only Linux.

          Kenny
	  
On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> Please, clarify!
>  
>  
> 
> Ameenah A. Ghoston
> Access Technology Specialist
> National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> 1800 Johnson St.
> Baltimore, Md. 21230
> Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> 
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

ot dectalk express

[Karen Lewellen]

and to think I just missed a sale.
If anyone has or knows of a used one for sale, please write me off list. 
I sent mine to be checked out by the great folks at personal data systems, 
but the news was not good.
Thanks,
Karen

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
And, why should it bother you?

Kenny Hitt writes:
> Hi.
> 
> I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> 
>           Kenny
> 	  
> On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > Please, clarify!
> >  
> >  
> > 
> > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > Access Technology Specialist
> > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > 1800 Johnson St.
> > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > 
> >  
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Gregory Nowak]

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Hash: SHA1

Bothersome or not, it personally took me a bit longer then normal to
figure out what she was talking about. What did personally bother me
about her post was that she seems to think that fedora is the only
"linux" (note the quotation marks). I would be concerned about this
narrowness to a newby's information, regardless of if the distribution
in question is fedora, debian, slackware, ETC.

Greg


On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> And, why should it bother you?
> 

- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

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Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

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Re: Speakup installation

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.

Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
sure newbys have complete information.

I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.

          Kenny

On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> And, why should it bother you?
> 
> Kenny Hitt writes:
> > Hi.
> > 
> > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > 
> >           Kenny
> > 	  
> > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > Please, clarify!
> > >  
> > >  
> > > 
> > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > 
> > >  
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> -- 
> 
> Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> 
> Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
not even come up. You know that, and I know that.

Kenny Hitt writes:
> Hi.
> 
> Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> sure newbys have complete information.
> 
> I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> 
>           Kenny
> 
> On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > And, why should it bother you?
> > 
> > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > Hi.
> > > 
> > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > 
> > >           Kenny
> > > 	  
> > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > Please, clarify!
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > -- 
> > 
> > Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > 
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.

Neither the subject, the origional question, or your reply 
mentioned that the question was specific to Fedora.
All I did in my origional reply was to mention this point.

Step back, chill out, and relax.

          Kenny

On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 09:54:44AM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
> share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
> this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
> very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
> seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
> incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
> fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
> of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
> they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
> not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
> 
> Kenny Hitt writes:
> > Hi.
> > 
> > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > sure newbys have complete information.
> > 
> > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> > 
> >           Kenny
> > 
> > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > > And, why should it bother you?
> > > 
> > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > Hi.
> > > > 
> > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > > 
> > > >           Kenny
> > > > 	  
> > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > >  
> > > > >  
> > > > > 
> > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > > > 
> > > > >  
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > 
> > > Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > > 
> > > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > > janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> -- 
> 
> Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> 
> Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

No, not until you explain why that's important to mention when it's not
important to mention several other things she left out. You know that's
insufficient context to place the question don't you? So, splain
yourself.

Kenny Hitt writes:
> Hi.
> 
> Neither the subject, the origional question, or your reply 
> mentioned that the question was specific to Fedora.
> All I did in my origional reply was to mention this point.
> 
> Step back, chill out, and relax.
> 
>           Kenny
> 
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 09:54:44AM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
> > share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
> > this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
> > very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
> > seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
> > incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
> > fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
> > of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
> > they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
> > not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
> > 
> > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > Hi.
> > > 
> > > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > > sure newbys have complete information.
> > > 
> > > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> > > 
> > >           Kenny
> > > 
> > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > > > And, why should it bother you?
> > > > 
> > > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > > Hi.
> > > > > 
> > > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > > > 
> > > > >           Kenny
> > > > > 	  
> > > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > > >  
> > > > > >  
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > >  
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > > 
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > 
> > > > -- 
> > > > 
> > > > Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > > > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > > > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > > > 
> > > > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > > > janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > -- 
> > 
> > Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > 
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I find it interesting that you are demanding an explanation for
something that is obvious to me at least, when you yourself failed to
give an explanation a while back to someone on here who wanted to know
something or other (I don't remember what now, though it's in the list
archives), about a fedora naming convention that was not obvious to
him and a few others, while it seemed from your posts that it was
perfectly obvious to you, and that you weren't going to discuss it anymore
for that, or maybe some other reason. So, if you're going to play, how
about playing fair?

Greg


On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 07:09:08PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> No, not until you explain why that's important to mention when it's not
> important to mention several other things she left out. You know that's
> insufficient context to place the question don't you? So, splain
> yourself.
> 

- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

- --
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
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Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

Shucks, Gregg. I'm lost in this message. Can't parse it. Sorry.

Gregory Nowak writes:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I find it interesting that you are demanding an explanation for
> something that is obvious to me at least, when you yourself failed to
> give an explanation a while back to someone on here who wanted to know
> something or other (I don't remember what now, though it's in the list
> archives), about a fedora naming convention that was not obvious to
> him and a few others, while it seemed from your posts that it was
> perfectly obvious to you, and that you weren't going to discuss it anymore
> for that, or maybe some other reason. So, if you're going to play, how
> about playing fair?
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 07:09:08PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > No, not until you explain why that's important to mention when it's not
> > important to mention several other things she left out. You know that's
> > insufficient context to place the question don't you? So, splain
> > yourself.
> > 
> 
> - -- 
> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
> 
> - --
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
> 
> iD8DBQFC4uSR7s9z/XlyUyARAjTMAKCS9fuUuWuPC4Bd0fpXYkiGkly0QQCfbL40
> lXyPgtRocKEqCrDO6yreMzM=
> =qh5t
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.

I've done everything I can on this subject. 
Obviously, I've upset you and I'm not sure how.
This is my last post on this thread.
If you wish to resolve this issue, contact me privatly.
You have my phone number as well as my email address.

          Kenny
	  
On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 07:09:08PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> No, not until you explain why that's important to mention when it's not
> important to mention several other things she left out. You know that's
> insufficient context to place the question don't you? So, splain
> yourself.
> 
> Kenny Hitt writes:
> > Hi.
> > 
> > Neither the subject, the origional question, or your reply 
> > mentioned that the question was specific to Fedora.
> > All I did in my origional reply was to mention this point.
> > 
> > Step back, chill out, and relax.
> > 
> >           Kenny
> > 
> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 09:54:44AM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
> > > share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
> > > this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
> > > very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
> > > seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
> > > incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
> > > fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
> > > of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
> > > they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
> > > not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
> > > 
> > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > Hi.
> > > > 
> > > > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > > > sure newbys have complete information.
> > > > 
> > > > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > > > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> > > > 
> > > >           Kenny
> > > > 
> > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > > > > And, why should it bother you?
> > > > > 
> > > > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > > > Hi.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > > > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > >           Kenny
> > > > > > 	  
> > > > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup? 
> > > > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > > > >  
> > > > > > >  
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > > > > > 

Re: Speakup installation

[ace]

Sounds like Janina needs to do a lot of relaxing.
Just remember, everyone, don't run down Fedora.  That's the best way 
to keep her quiet.

At 10:31 AM 7/23/2005, you wrote:
>Hi.
>
>Neither the subject, the origional question, or your reply
>mentioned that the question was specific to Fedora.
>All I did in my origional reply was to mention this point.
>
>Step back, chill out, and relax.
>
>           Kenny
>
>On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 09:54:44AM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
> > share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
> > this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
> > very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
> > seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
> > incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
> > fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
> > of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
> > they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
> > not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
> >
> > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > > sure newbys have complete information.
> > >
> > > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> > >
> > >           Kenny
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > > > And, why should it bother you?
> > > >
> > > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > > Hi.
> > > > >
> > > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > > >
> > > > >           Kenny
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup?
> > > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > Janina Sajka                              Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > > > Partner, Capital Accessibility 
> LLC        http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > > > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and 
> Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > > >
> > > > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup            Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > > > janina@freestandards.org          http://a11y.org
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka                          Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC    http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and 
> Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup                Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org              http://a11y.org
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.

I wasn't running down Fedora.  If anyone thought that from my message,
they are wrong.

          Kenny
	  
On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 10:32:30PM -0400, ace wrote:
> Sounds like Janina needs to do a lot of relaxing.
> Just remember, everyone, don't run down Fedora.  That's the best way 
> to keep her quiet.
> 

Re: Speakup installation

[Charles Hallenbeck]

On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 10:04:26PM -0500, Kenny Hitt wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> I wasn't running down Fedora.  If anyone thought that from my message,
> they are wrong.
> 
>           Kenny
It was obvious to me that you were simply providing a context for the 
original post by pointing out that it was referring to a Fedora 
installation, and that Fedora is only one distribution among many. If 
someone regards that as "putting down" Fedora, that is very likely not 
your problem.

BTW: As everyone knows,  a "full installation" will involve 14 CD 
images.

Chuck


-- 
The Moon is Waning Gibbous (88% of Full)
But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh

RE: Speakup installation

[Steve Dawes]

Chuck,

It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install is 14
cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in addition
to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.

The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full install,
is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point is
that it installs both kde and gnome.
Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install the
source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and want.

If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no need
to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much space
can be saved when you take this approach.

Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I am
saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
something that tells the user where they can find out more information on
how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going to
use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
creating a smaller or tidier installation.



Steve

Steve Dawes
Calgary Canada.

Re: Speakup installation

[Charles Hallenbeck]

No typo. The complete Debian package comes on 14 CD's, that's fourteen, 
ten plus four, The point being that I simply assumed you would know I 
meant Debian.


On Sun, Jul 24, 2005 at 09:26:51AM -0600, Steve Dawes wrote:
> Chuck,
> 
> It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install is 14
> cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in addition
> to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> 
> The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full install,
> is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point is
> that it installs both kde and gnome.
> Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install the
> source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and want.
> 
> If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no need
> to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much space
> can be saved when you take this approach.
> 
> Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I am
> saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> something that tells the user where they can find out more information on
> how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going to
> use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> 
> 
> 
> Steve
> 
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
The Moon is Waning Gibbous (85% of Full)
But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh

Re: Speakup installation

[hank smith]

and you need all 14 cds?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles Hallenbeck" <chuckh@hhs48.com>
To: <sdawes@telus.net>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> No typo. The complete Debian package comes on 14 CD's, that's fourteen,
> ten plus four, The point being that I simply assumed you would know I
> meant Debian.
>
>
> On Sun, Jul 24, 2005 at 09:26:51AM -0600, Steve Dawes wrote:
> > Chuck,
> >
> > It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install
is 14
> > cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in
addition
> > to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> >
> > The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full
install,
> > is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> > unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point
is
> > that it installs both kde and gnome.
> > Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> > installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install
the
> > source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> > teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and
want.
> >
> > If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no
need
> > to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much
space
> > can be saved when you take this approach.
> >
> > Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I
am
> > saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> > time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> > something that tells the user where they can find out more information
on
> > how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going
to
> > use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page

> > does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> > creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> >
> >
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Steve Dawes
> > Calgary Canada.
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> --
> The Moon is Waning Gibbous (85% of Full)
> But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
>
>

Re: Speakup installation

[Charles Hallenbeck]

Heavens no, no one does a full installation. 

On Sun, Jul 24, 2005 at 09:35:28AM -0700, hank smith wrote:
> and you need all 14 cds?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Charles Hallenbeck" <chuckh@hhs48.com>
> To: <sdawes@telus.net>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:04 AM
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
> 
> 
> > No typo. The complete Debian package comes on 14 CD's, that's fourteen,
> > ten plus four, The point being that I simply assumed you would know I
> > meant Debian.
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 24, 2005 at 09:26:51AM -0600, Steve Dawes wrote:
> > > Chuck,
> > >
> > > It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install
> is 14
> > > cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in
> addition
> > > to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> > >
> > > The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full
> install,
> > > is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> > > unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point
> is
> > > that it installs both kde and gnome.
> > > Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> > > installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install
> the
> > > source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> > > teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and
> want.
> > >
> > > If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no
> need
> > > to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much
> space
> > > can be saved when you take this approach.
> > >
> > > Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I
> am
> > > saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> > > time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> > > something that tells the user where they can find out more information
> on
> > > how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going
> to
> > > use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> 
> > > does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> > > creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > > Steve Dawes
> > > Calgary Canada.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > --
> > The Moon is Waning Gibbous (85% of Full)
> > But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
> >
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
The Moon is Waning Gibbous (85% of Full)
But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh

Re: Speakup installation

[Sean McMahon]

No that's the full installation.  That's why they provide the netinst iso so you
may install what you need.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "hank smith" <hanksmith4@earthlink.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> and you need all 14 cds?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Charles Hallenbeck" <chuckh@hhs48.com>
> To: <sdawes@telus.net>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:04 AM
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
>
>
> > No typo. The complete Debian package comes on 14 CD's, that's fourteen,
> > ten plus four, The point being that I simply assumed you would know I
> > meant Debian.
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 24, 2005 at 09:26:51AM -0600, Steve Dawes wrote:
> > > Chuck,
> > >
> > > It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install
> is 14
> > > cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in
> addition
> > > to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> > >
> > > The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full
> install,
> > > is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> > > unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point
> is
> > > that it installs both kde and gnome.
> > > Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> > > installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install
> the
> > > source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> > > teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and
> want.
> > >
> > > If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no
> need
> > > to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much
> space
> > > can be saved when you take this approach.
> > >
> > > Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I
> am
> > > saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> > > time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> > > something that tells the user where they can find out more information
> on
> > > how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going
> to
> > > use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
>
> > > does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> > > creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > > Steve Dawes
> > > Calgary Canada.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > --
> > The Moon is Waning Gibbous (85% of Full)
> > But you can still get downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

The minimal install is a viable option. So is an "everything" install.
Each has advantages and disadvantages, as I see it.

Nothing prevents anyone from writing the documentation you're
suggesting.

Steve Dawes writes:
> Chuck,
> 
> It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install is 14
> cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in addition
> to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> 
> The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full install,
> is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point is
> that it installs both kde and gnome.
> Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install the
> source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and want.
> 
> If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no need
> to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much space
> can be saved when you take this approach.
> 
> Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I am
> saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> something that tells the user where they can find out more information on
> how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going to
> use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> 
> 
> 
> Steve
> 
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[hank smith]

ow many cds is a  oppsion, and how many cds is a everything oppsion minus
all the source crap?
I am trying to find out how many isos I need to getminimal
----- Original Message -----
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: <sdawes@telus.net>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> The minimal install is a viable option. So is an "everything" install.
> Each has advantages and disadvantages, as I see it.
>
> Nothing prevents anyone from writing the documentation you're
> suggesting.
>
> Steve Dawes writes:
> > Chuck,
> >
> > It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install
is 14
> > cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in
addition
> > to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> >
> > The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full
install,
> > is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> > unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point
is
> > that it installs both kde and gnome.
> > Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> > installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install
the
> > source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> > teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and
want.
> >
> > If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no
need
> > to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much
space
> > can be saved when you take this approach.
> >
> > Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I
am
> > saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> > time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> > something that tells the user where they can find out more information
on
> > how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going
to
> > use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> > does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> > creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> >
> >
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Steve Dawes
> > Calgary Canada.
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> --
>
> Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go
to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
>
> Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG)
> janina@freestandards.org http://a11y.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
>
>

Re: Speakup installation

[Doug Sutherland]

You only need 2 debian CDs, and you can also boot from a network install CD
and install most of the packages over the net.

  -- Doug

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

If you're going to install the Speakup Modified Fedora, you'll need the
images named in the installation HOWTO.

I can't tell you anymore than I've already told you in that document.

hank smith writes:
> ow many cds is a  oppsion, and how many cds is a everything oppsion minus
> all the source crap?
> I am trying to find out how many isos I need to getminimal
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
> To: <sdawes@telus.net>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:10 PM
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
> 
> 
> > The minimal install is a viable option. So is an "everything" install.
> > Each has advantages and disadvantages, as I see it.
> >
> > Nothing prevents anyone from writing the documentation you're
> > suggesting.
> >
> > Steve Dawes writes:
> > > Chuck,
> > >
> > > It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install
> is 14
> > > cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in
> addition
> > > to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
> > >
> > > The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full
> install,
> > > is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> > > unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point
> is
> > > that it installs both kde and gnome.
> > > Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> > > installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install
> the
> > > source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> > > teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and
> want.
> > >
> > > If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no
> need
> > > to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much
> space
> > > can be saved when you take this approach.
> > >
> > > Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I
> am
> > > saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> > > time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> > > something that tells the user where they can find out more information
> on
> > > how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going
> to
> > > use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> > > does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> > > creating a smaller or tidier installation.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > > Steve Dawes
> > > Calgary Canada.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go
> to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org http://a11y.org
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
> >
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

RE: Speakup installation

[Steve Dawes]

Well, the simplest answer is that you can do it using 1 DVD, or 4 CDS.
Regardless of the type of installation you are going to do, it is best to
have all 4 cds if that is the media of choice just incase you select a
package that is located on disks 2 through 4. If you have a DVD rom on the
intended linux box, then just use the dvd approach.


Steve

Steve Dawes
Calgary Canada.

Re: Speakup installation

[hank smith]

is there a iso of the dvd?
only place I saw to get one is jecto and that is confusing as heck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Dawes" <sdawes@telus.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:35 PM
Subject: RE: Speakup installation


> Well, the simplest answer is that you can do it using 1 DVD, or 4 CDS.
> Regardless of the type of installation you are going to do, it is best to
> have all 4 cds if that is the media of choice just incase you select a
> package that is located on disks 2 through 4. If you have a DVD rom on the
> intended linux box, then just use the dvd approach.
>
>
> Steve
>
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
>
>

Re: Speakup installation

[Sean McMahon]

I like this new format where we ask and answer questions reguardless of distro.
Quite amusing.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Dawes" <sdawes@telus.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:35 PM
Subject: RE: Speakup installation


> Well, the simplest answer is that you can do it using 1 DVD, or 4 CDS.
> Regardless of the type of installation you are going to do, it is best to
> have all 4 cds if that is the media of choice just incase you select a
> package that is located on disks 2 through 4. If you have a DVD rom on the
> intended linux box, then just use the dvd approach.
>
>
> Steve
>
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

RE: Speakup installation

[Jim Grimsby]

If you're going to install the Speakup Modified Fedora, you'll need the
images named in the installation HOWTO.
You can find this document at 
https://linux-speakup.org/ftp/disks/fedora/index.html

RE: Speakup installation

[Scott Berry]

Hi Jim,

Here is a good one any idea what the kernel rpms are that are on 
Kirk's site?  Do they have speakup compiled in just need to rpm the 
package on to Fedora?



At 09:31 AM 7/25/2005, you wrote:



>If you're going to install the Speakup Modified Fedora, you'll need the
>images named in the installation HOWTO.
>You can find this document at
>https://linux-speakup.org/ftp/disks/fedora/index.html
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

RE: Speakup installation

[Jim Grimsby]

Hi, yes these already have speakup in the kernal 
Hth 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of Scott Berry
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 7:58 AM
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: RE: Speakup installation


Hi Jim,

Here is a good one any idea what the kernel rpms are that are on 
Kirk's site?  Do they have speakup compiled in just need to rpm the 
package on to Fedora?



At 09:31 AM 7/25/2005, you wrote:



>If you're going to install the Speakup Modified Fedora, you'll need the

>images named in the installation HOWTO. You can find this document at
>https://linux-speakup.org/ftp/disks/fedora/index.html
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Sean McMahon]

Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really should have info
explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an installation for
small systems under 1gb.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Dawes" <sdawes@telus.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:26 AM
Subject: RE: Speakup installation


> Chuck,
>
> It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install is 14
> cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source in addition
> to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
>
> The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full install,
> is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs a lot of
> unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case in point is
> that it installs both kde and gnome.
> Additionally, it doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it
> installs almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install the
> source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in
> teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and want.
>
> If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no need
> to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how much space
> can be saved when you take this approach.
>
> Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. I am
> saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets the first
> time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see however, is
> something that tells the user where they can find out more information on
> how to trim down their installation to only the packages they are going to
> use included in the howto. A simple reference to the Linux document page
> does nothing to direct a new or novice user to good information about
> creating a smaller or tidier installation.
>
>
>
> Steve
>
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Thomas Stivers]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

On Mon, Jul 25, 2005 at 11:10:09 AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really should have info
> explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an installation for
> small systems under 1gb.

Remember that this is all open source, you *are* they and if not then
there is no they to speak of. IMHO with the new debian sarge netinst iso
its easy to install a small system and add or remove packages as you
need them. All hail apt-get!

- -- 
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan

Thomas Stivers	e-mail: stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQFC5TBk5JK61UXLur0RA0xzAJ9VoWu5d3vWVzLmKRS6zG7FDA8htgCfQ1kM
GmbI7yO/u7eK5X8AJq5bgGM=
=i/95
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: Speakup installation

[hank smith]

hale apt-get
hale hale hale smily
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Stivers" <stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:33 AM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: RIPEMD160
>
> On Mon, Jul 25, 2005 at 11:10:09 AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> > Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really should
have info
> > explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an
installation for
> > small systems under 1gb.
>
> Remember that this is all open source, you *are* they and if not then
> there is no they to speak of. IMHO with the new debian sarge netinst iso
> its easy to install a small system and add or remove packages as you
> need them. All hail apt-get!
>
> - --
> "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
> Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
> by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan
>
> Thomas Stivers e-mail: stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFC5TBk5JK61UXLur0RA0xzAJ9VoWu5d3vWVzLmKRS6zG7FDA8htgCfQ1kM
> GmbI7yO/u7eK5X8AJq5bgGM=
> =i/95
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005
>
>

RE: Speakup installation

[Jim Grimsby]

Just make sure you read the apt how to first.
Hth 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of hank smith
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 3:18 PM
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


hale apt-get
hale hale hale smily
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Stivers" <stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:33 AM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: RIPEMD160
>
> On Mon, Jul 25, 2005 at 11:10:09 AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> > Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really 
> > should
have info
> > explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an
installation for
> > small systems under 1gb.
>
> Remember that this is all open source, you *are* they and if not then 
> there is no they to speak of. IMHO with the new debian sarge netinst 
> iso its easy to install a small system and add or remove packages as 
> you need them. All hail apt-get!
>
> - --
> "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. 
> Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by 
> definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan
>
> Thomas Stivers e-mail: stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFC5TBk5JK61UXLur0RA0xzAJ9VoWu5d3vWVzLmKRS6zG7FDA8htgCfQ1kM
> GmbI7yO/u7eK5X8AJq5bgGM=
> =i/95
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 
> 7/22/2005
>
>


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

Jim Grimsby writes:
> Just make sure you read the apt how to first.

Yeah, that'll convince 'em to just go with the 'Everything' install.
<grin>

Oh, I know it's dreadfully easy, after you've installed, configured, and
learned to use it. But, that's the thing quite a few folks would just as
happily avoid in the midst of getting anything working in the first
place.

And, of course, the apt HOWTO won't tell you what to use for reading
mail, browsing the web, etc. Of course, neither does the "everything"
install, but it does take yet one more thing to do off the list of
things to do. Not everyone is concerned about installing things they
will never use. Not everyone has a minimalist prejudice.

> Hth 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
> [mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of hank smith
> Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 3:18 PM
> To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
> 
> 
> hale apt-get
> hale hale hale smily
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thomas Stivers" <stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:33 AM
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
> 
> 
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: RIPEMD160
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 25, 2005 at 11:10:09 AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> > > Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really 
> > > should
> have info
> > > explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an
> installation for
> > > small systems under 1gb.
> >
> > Remember that this is all open source, you *are* they and if not then 
> > there is no they to speak of. IMHO with the new debian sarge netinst 
> > iso its easy to install a small system and add or remove packages as 
> > you need them. All hail apt-get!
> >
> > - --
> > "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. 
> > Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by 
> > definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan
> >
> > Thomas Stivers e-mail: stivers_t@tomass.dyndns.org
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
> >
> > iD8DBQFC5TBk5JK61UXLur0RA0xzAJ9VoWu5d3vWVzLmKRS6zG7FDA8htgCfQ1kM
> > GmbI7yO/u7eK5X8AJq5bgGM=
> > =i/95
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 
> > 7/22/2005
> >
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

Oh, and one more thing, after you read the apt HOWTO, try the yum HOWTO.
It's even easier than apt, imho, and arguably more secure.

> Jim Grimsby writes:
> > Just make sure you read the apt how to first.

Re: Speakup installation

[Sean McMahon]

Why do you think yum is more secure?
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:35 PM
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


> Oh, and one more thing, after you read the apt HOWTO, try the yum HOWTO.
> It's even easier than apt, imho, and arguably more secure.
> 
> > Jim Grimsby writes:
> > > Just make sure you read the apt how to first.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speakup installation

[Janina Sajka]

It supports GPG rpm package signing. You wouldn't just blindly install
anything you download from the Internet, now would you?


Sean McMahon writes:
> Why do you think yum is more secure?
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:35 PM
> Subject: Re: Speakup installation
> 
> 
> > Oh, and one more thing, after you read the apt HOWTO, try the yum HOWTO.
> > It's even easier than apt, imho, and arguably more secure.
> > 
> > > Jim Grimsby writes:
> > > > Just make sure you read the apt how to first.
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC	http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

RE: Speakup installation

[Jim Grimsby]

Hi, the redhat documentation does explain all of this.  
Maybe we should all read all the documentation before you bitch.
Also remember that the documentation as writing is for basic new users
wanting an easy install.
I my self would tell people to install everything just so you have it.  
Like sam says from the lord of the rings "you will want it, if you have
not got it" 
Hth 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of Sean McMahon
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:10 AM
To: sdawes@telus.net; Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


Good point, aren't computers supposed to be easy?  They really should
have info explaining, I mean as Janina said, "splainin'", how to make an
installation for small systems under 1gb.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Dawes" <sdawes@telus.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:26 AM
Subject: RE: Speakup installation


> Chuck,
>
> It isn't quite that bad. Your type'o has suggested that a full install

> is 14 cds. I think you meant to say 4 cds. If you install all source 
> in addition to all the binaries, you end up with 7 or 8 cds or 2 dvds.
>
> The problem I have with the selecting everything, or doing the full 
> install, is that it is the easy way out. Yes it works, but it installs

> a lot of unnecessary stuff and uses up a lot of resources. A good case

> in point is that it installs both kde and gnome. Additionally, it 
> doesn't install absolutely everything as it implies, it installs 
> almost everything on the binary disks and you need to install the 
> source separately if you wish to. This approach also does nothing in 
> teaching how to set up a system with only the packages you need and 
> want.
>
> If you are only going to be using console based programs, there is no 
> need to install any of the kde or gnome packages. It is incredible how

> much space can be saved when you take this approach.
>
> Now I am not knocking the installation howto that Janina has written. 
> I am saying that what it does is a quick and easy install that gets 
> the first time user up-and-running on Linux. What I would like to see 
> however, is something that tells the user where they can find out more

> information on how to trim down their installation to only the 
> packages they are going to use included in the howto. A simple 
> reference to the Linux document page does nothing to direct a new or 
> novice user to good information about creating a smaller or tidier 
> installation.
>
>
>
> Steve
>
> Steve Dawes
> Calgary Canada.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re[2]: Speakup installation

[Farhan]

Hi, maybe a nice vacation in Florida will be good for her, the beach
and all that. You no, get away from all that bleh linux stuff.
clearly. not using windows for years and years and years has maybe
made her a bit touchy?

on7/23/2005ace said  
Sounds like Janina needs to do a lot of relaxing.
Just remember, everyone, don't run down Fedora.  That's the best way 
to keep her quiet.

At 10:31 AM 7/23/2005, you wrote:
>Hi.
>
>Neither the subject, the origional question, or your reply
>mentioned that the question was specific to Fedora.
>All I did in my origional reply was to mention this point.
>
>Step back, chill out, and relax.
>
>           Kenny
>
>On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 09:54:44AM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
> > share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
> > this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
> > very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
> > seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
> > incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
> > fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
> > of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
> > they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
> > not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
> >
> > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > > sure newbys have complete information.
> > >
> > > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> > >
> > >           Kenny
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered you?
> > > > And, why should it bother you?
> > > >
> > > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > > Hi.
> > > > >
> > > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora.
> > > > > Other Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > > >
> > > > >           Kenny
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup?
> > > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
> > > > > > 1800 Johnson St.
> > > > > > Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > >
> > > > Janina Sajka                              Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > > > Partner, Capital Accessibility 
> LLC        http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > > > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and 
> Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > > >
> > > > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup            Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > > > janina@freestandards.org          http://a11y.org
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka                          Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC    http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and 
> Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup                Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org              http://a11y.org
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Farhan
contact info.
Aim: and stoof
msn: i.am.Farhan@gmail.com
Jabber: Farhan@jabber.org

Re: Speakup installation

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hmm, with the hurricanes, and all the shark attacks, I probably wouldn't
recommend Florida. No offense to anyone who happens to live there
(smile).

Greg


On Sat, Jul 23, 2005 at 11:24:46PM -0500, Farhan wrote:
> Hi, maybe a nice vacation in Florida will be good for her, the beach
> and all that. You no, get away from all that bleh linux stuff.
> clearly. not using windows for years and years and years has maybe
> made her a bit touchy?
> 

- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

- --
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
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Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

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VnkNy3jpHsGANgIe0JSh7MM=
=2h8k
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

RE: Speakup installation

[Jim Grimsby]

Hi,
If a new be has a question let him or her ask it.  That is the first
step of a new be to ask a question.  Being one not to long ago my self I
know the truth of that one.  
Hth 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of Janina Sajka
Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 6:55 AM
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: Speakup installation


I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
not even come up. You know that, and I know that.

Kenny Hitt writes:
> Hi.
> 
> Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making 
> sure newbys have complete information.
> 
> I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for 
> years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> 
>           Kenny
> 
> On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications 
> > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered 
> > you? And, why should it bother you?
> > 
> > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > Hi.
> > > 
> > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora. Other

> > > Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of 
> > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > 
> > >           Kenny
> > > 	  
> > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup?
> > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > Please, clarify!
> > > >  
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute 1800 Johnson

> > > > St. Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org 
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > --
> > 
> > Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC
http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and 
> > Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > 
> > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group
(FSG)
> > janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka				Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC
http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go
to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup		Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina@freestandards.org		http://a11y.org

_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

RE: Speak up installation

[Scott Berry]

Actually talking about newbies what are the srpms for Fedora 
for.  What purpose do they serve?  It's been a long time since I have 
ran Fedora or a Red Hat derivatives.

At 12:55 PM 7/23/2005, you wrote:

>Hi,
>If a new be has a question let him or her ask it.  That is the first
>step of a new be to ask a question.  Being one not to long ago my self I
>know the truth of that one.
>Hth
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
>[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca] On Behalf Of Janina Sajka
>Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 6:55 AM
>To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
>Subject: Re: Speakup installation
>
>
>I think the archives of this list will support me when I say that I
>share your (and Gregg's) concern for newbies. However, that defense in
>this instance strikes me as a fig leaf. I would not have to dig back
>very far at all in the archives to find posts from any number of
>seasoned veterans on this list that would undoubtedly be
>incomprehensible to newbies. Sorry. I don't buy it--especially when I
>fail to see anything in the original question which would cause any kind
>of harm to any newbie trying to do anything with Linux. For instance, if
>they're installing Slack, Debian, Gentoo, or whatever, the issue would
>not even come up. You know that, and I know that.
>
>Kenny Hitt writes:
> > Hi.
> >
> > Gregs message says it better than I could.  My problem is with making
> > sure newbys have complete information.
> >
> > I only knew she was talking about Fedora from reading this list for
> > years.  Nothing in her message would have made that clear to a newby.
> >
> >           Kenny
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 10:00:25PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > > Oh, dear. Where's the problem? There were several specifications
> > > unreferenced in her email. But, this is the only one that bothered
> > > you? And, why should it bother you?
> > >
> > > Kenny Hitt writes:
> > > > Hi.
> > > >
> > > > I would like to point out this info is only true for Fedora. Other
>
> > > > Linux distros are different.  Please don't make the mistake of
> > > > deciding Fedora is the only Linux.
> > > >
> > > >           Kenny
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Jul 22, 2005 at 01:03:59PM -0400, Ghoston, Ameenah wrote:
> > > > > Why must the user do a server install for Speakup?
> > > > > And then, ask the user to do an everything install?
> > > > > Please, clarify!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Ameenah A. Ghoston
> > > > > Access Technology Specialist
> > > > > National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute 1800 Johnson
>
> > > > > St. Baltimore, Md. 21230
> > > > > Phone 410-659-9314-2414
> > > > > email: aghoston@nfb.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Janina Sajka                                Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> > > Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC
>http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
> > > Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and
> > > Canada. Go to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
> > >
> > > Chair, Accessibility Workgroup              Free Standards Group
>(FSG)
> > > janina@freestandards.org            http://a11y.org
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>--
>
>Janina Sajka                            Phone: +1.202.494.7040
>Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC
>http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
>Bringing the Owasys 22C screenless cell phone to the U.S. and Canada. Go
>to http://www.ScreenlessPhone.Com to learn more.
>
>Chair, Accessibility Workgroup          Free Standards Group (FSG)
>janina@freestandards.org                http://a11y.org
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup