* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
@ ` Cecil H. Whitley
` Gregory Nowak
` Alex Snow
` Gregory Nowak
` (4 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 2 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Cecil H. Whitley @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi,
I've left your post intact. Just a couple comments about it. Prior to
windows xp m.s. did not have a product which would provide speech while it
was installing. Slackware has an out-of-the-box speech enabled install and
has for a while. There are list members here whom donate their time doing
the same for redhat. Apparently that goes back a ways given the number of
releases held on the speakup ftp site. I can't speak for other list
members, but I try to answer all questions that I can (my knowledge base is
also limited). In at least one instance I have pointed a user to a "howto",
but that is because of my ignorance on the subject matter and I would prefer
to give accurate information as opposed to being overly helpfull and
exceeding my knowledge base. Wrong answers do more damage than harm (at
least in my opinion). Don't get me wrong, i'm not perfect nor is my record.
I do however try to clearly identify areas that are "guesses" as opposed to
"fact".
At least with linux all the documentation is available on-line and in fact,
much of it comes with the distribution. That's why redhat has a cd
dedicated to documentation. Linux, like windows is an extremely complex set
of various software packages. Your mileage may vary depending on the
hardware you have and the choices you make in the installation process.
apropos is a good command to remember as is man and info.
In conclusion, if you want a stable gui environment with optional text mode
that doesn't crash several times a day, buy os/2! It's easy to setup and
runs like a champ. It is however a bit dated.
Regards,
Cecil
----- Original Message -----
From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@home.ro>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 12:14 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux by
> myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many things
> about Linux.
> In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could press
the
> "next" button and the system will be installed.
> A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying to
> install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors and
they
> were criptical for me.
>
> What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> others.
> They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just to
get
> the information I want.
>
> I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a few
> months, but it is not my style of learning.
>
> I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
>
> This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> telling me what's wrong.
>
> I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
it...
> It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think, but I
> should learn by manual and it is not my style.
>
> I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go to
> http:// ....
> I think you've got the idea.
>
> Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really try
to
> help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but Linux
> people don't have the time.
>
> Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some
stupid
> questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help from
the
> people who know, then why joining a list?
> Just for pointing to a web page?
> I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find with a
> single question and answer.
>
> I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time to
read
> them all.
>
> With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but is
> very hard to follow this way under Linux.
>
> Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
>
> Teddy,
> orasnita@home.ro
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> that other stuff go. You don't need it.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>
> > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think that's
> the
> > problem.
> > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use pirated
> > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that produces
that
> > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I
won't
> > use it. That's all.
> >
> > Teddy,
> > orasnita@home.ro
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in many
> > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same provisions
> > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > access.
> >
> > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how one
> > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > might attract some unwanted attention.
> >
> > Brian.
> >
> >
> > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> >
> > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> >
> > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > >To speak, not to crack.
> > >
> > >Thank you for information.
> > >Teddy,
> > >orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > course, I
> > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > countries.
> > >Greg
> > >
> > >
> > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > >> *snip*
> > >>
> > >> > Hey Igor,
> > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > >>
> > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After all,
> > there
> > >is
> > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly over
> > the
> > >line
> > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to see
> > this
> > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > could
> > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >>
> > >> Cecil Whitley
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Speakup mailing list
> > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >Speakup mailing list
> > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >Speakup mailing list
> > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> --
>
> Janina Sajka, Director
> Technology Research and Development
> Governmental Relations Group
> American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
>
> Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
>
> Chair, Accessibility SIG
> Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> http://www.openebook.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Cecil H. Whitley
@ ` Gregory Nowak
` Alex Snow
` Alex Snow
1 sibling, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Gregory Nowak @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
That's something else. I've heard that the screen reader for os/2 is about $800, and it's the only one out there too.
Greg
On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 12:37:17AM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> Hi,
> I've left your post intact. Just a couple comments about it. Prior to
> windows xp m.s. did not have a product which would provide speech while it
> was installing. Slackware has an out-of-the-box speech enabled install and
> has for a while. There are list members here whom donate their time doing
> the same for redhat. Apparently that goes back a ways given the number of
> releases held on the speakup ftp site. I can't speak for other list
> members, but I try to answer all questions that I can (my knowledge base is
> also limited). In at least one instance I have pointed a user to a "howto",
> but that is because of my ignorance on the subject matter and I would prefer
> to give accurate information as opposed to being overly helpfull and
> exceeding my knowledge base. Wrong answers do more damage than harm (at
> least in my opinion). Don't get me wrong, i'm not perfect nor is my record.
> I do however try to clearly identify areas that are "guesses" as opposed to
> "fact".
>
> At least with linux all the documentation is available on-line and in fact,
> much of it comes with the distribution. That's why redhat has a cd
> dedicated to documentation. Linux, like windows is an extremely complex set
> of various software packages. Your mileage may vary depending on the
> hardware you have and the choices you make in the installation process.
> apropos is a good command to remember as is man and info.
>
> In conclusion, if you want a stable gui environment with optional text mode
> that doesn't crash several times a day, buy os/2! It's easy to setup and
> runs like a champ. It is however a bit dated.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cecil
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@home.ro>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 12:14 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> > Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux by
> > myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many things
> > about Linux.
> > In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could press
> the
> > "next" button and the system will be installed.
> > A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying to
> > install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors and
> they
> > were criptical for me.
> >
> > What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> > The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> > others.
> > They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> > Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> > The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just to
> get
> > the information I want.
> >
> > I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a few
> > months, but it is not my style of learning.
> >
> > I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
> >
> > This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> > telling me what's wrong.
> >
> > I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
> it...
> > It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> > They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think, but I
> > should learn by manual and it is not my style.
> >
> > I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go to
> > http:// ....
> > I think you've got the idea.
> >
> > Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really try
> to
> > help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but Linux
> > people don't have the time.
> >
> > Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some
> stupid
> > questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> > Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help from
> the
> > people who know, then why joining a list?
> > Just for pointing to a web page?
> > I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> > Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find with a
> > single question and answer.
> >
> > I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time to
> read
> > them all.
> >
> > With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but is
> > very hard to follow this way under Linux.
> >
> > Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
> >
> > Teddy,
> > orasnita@home.ro
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> > "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> > further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> > over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> > of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> > that other stuff go. You don't need it.
> >
> > On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think that's
> > the
> > > problem.
> > > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use pirated
> > > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that produces
> that
> > > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I
> won't
> > > use it. That's all.
> > >
> > > Teddy,
> > > orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in many
> > > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same provisions
> > > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > > access.
> > >
> > > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how one
> > > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > > might attract some unwanted attention.
> > >
> > > Brian.
> > >
> > >
> > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> > >
> > > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > >
> > > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > > >To speak, not to crack.
> > > >
> > > >Thank you for information.
> > > >Teddy,
> > > >orasnita@home.ro
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > > course, I
> > > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > > countries.
> > > >Greg
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > > >> *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> > Hey Igor,
> > > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After all,
> > > there
> > > >is
> > > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly over
> > > the
> > > >line
> > > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to see
> > > this
> > > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > > could
> > > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> Cecil Whitley
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >> Speakup mailing list
> > > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka, Director
> > Technology Research and Development
> > Governmental Relations Group
> > American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
> >
> > Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility SIG
> > Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> > http://www.openebook.org
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` Alex Snow
0 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Alex Snow @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hmm... sounds like another monoply!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 1:10 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> That's something else. I've heard that the screen reader for os/2 is about
$800, and it's the only one out there too.
> Greg
>
>
> On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 12:37:17AM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > Hi,
> > I've left your post intact. Just a couple comments about it. Prior to
> > windows xp m.s. did not have a product which would provide speech while
it
> > was installing. Slackware has an out-of-the-box speech enabled install
and
> > has for a while. There are list members here whom donate their time
doing
> > the same for redhat. Apparently that goes back a ways given the number
of
> > releases held on the speakup ftp site. I can't speak for other list
> > members, but I try to answer all questions that I can (my knowledge base
is
> > also limited). In at least one instance I have pointed a user to a
"howto",
> > but that is because of my ignorance on the subject matter and I would
prefer
> > to give accurate information as opposed to being overly helpfull and
> > exceeding my knowledge base. Wrong answers do more damage than harm (at
> > least in my opinion). Don't get me wrong, i'm not perfect nor is my
record.
> > I do however try to clearly identify areas that are "guesses" as opposed
to
> > "fact".
> >
> > At least with linux all the documentation is available on-line and in
fact,
> > much of it comes with the distribution. That's why redhat has a cd
> > dedicated to documentation. Linux, like windows is an extremely complex
set
> > of various software packages. Your mileage may vary depending on the
> > hardware you have and the choices you make in the installation process.
> > apropos is a good command to remember as is man and info.
> >
> > In conclusion, if you want a stable gui environment with optional text
mode
> > that doesn't crash several times a day, buy os/2! It's easy to setup
and
> > runs like a champ. It is however a bit dated.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Cecil
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@home.ro>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 12:14 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > > Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux
by
> > > myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many
things
> > > about Linux.
> > > In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could
press
> > the
> > > "next" button and the system will be installed.
> > > A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying
to
> > > install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors
and
> > they
> > > were criptical for me.
> > >
> > > What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> > > The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> > > others.
> > > They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> > > Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> > > The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just
to
> > get
> > > the information I want.
> > >
> > > I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a
few
> > > months, but it is not my style of learning.
> > >
> > > I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
> > >
> > > This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error
message
> > > telling me what's wrong.
> > >
> > > I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
> > it...
> > > It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> > > They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think,
but I
> > > should learn by manual and it is not my style.
> > >
> > > I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go
to
> > > http:// ....
> > > I think you've got the idea.
> > >
> > > Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really
try
> > to
> > > help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but
Linux
> > > people don't have the time.
> > >
> > > Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some
> > stupid
> > > questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> > > Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help
from
> > the
> > > people who know, then why joining a list?
> > > Just for pointing to a web page?
> > > I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> > > Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find
with a
> > > single question and answer.
> > >
> > > I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time
to
> > read
> > > them all.
> > >
> > > With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but
is
> > > very hard to follow this way under Linux.
> > >
> > > Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
> > >
> > > Teddy,
> > > orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> > > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > > This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> > > "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> > > further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> > > over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> > > of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> > > that other stuff go. You don't need it.
> > >
> > > On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > >
> > > > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think
that's
> > > the
> > > > problem.
> > > > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use
pirated
> > > > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > > > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that
produces
> > that
> > > > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I
> > won't
> > > > use it. That's all.
> > > >
> > > > Teddy,
> > > > orasnita@home.ro
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in
many
> > > > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > > > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same
provisions
> > > > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > > > access.
> > > >
> > > > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how
one
> > > > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > > > might attract some unwanted attention.
> > > >
> > > > Brian.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> > > >
> > > > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > > > >To speak, not to crack.
> > > > >
> > > > >Thank you for information.
> > > > >Teddy,
> > > > >orasnita@home.ro
> > > > >
> > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > > > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > > > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > > > course, I
> > > > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > > > countries.
> > > > >Greg
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > > > >> *snip*
> > > > >>
> > > > >> > Hey Igor,
> > > > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After
all,
> > > > there
> > > > >is
> > > > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly
over
> > > > the
> > > > >line
> > > > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to
see
> > > > this
> > > > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > > > could
> > > > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Regards,
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Cecil Whitley
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > > >> Speakup mailing list
> > > > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > >
> > > > >_______________________________________________
> > > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >_______________________________________________
> > > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Janina Sajka, Director
> > > Technology Research and Development
> > > Governmental Relations Group
> > > American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
> > >
> > > Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
> > >
> > > Chair, Accessibility SIG
> > > Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> > > http://www.openebook.org
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Cecil H. Whitley
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` Alex Snow
` Janina Sajka
1 sibling, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Alex Snow @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
And now they want to release earlier versions of winblows with the speach in
the install. Why the hell would I want to go back to an earlier version of
winblows? Why the hell would I want to go back to winblows anyway? To give
gates enough money to add that 150th indoor heated pool to his house? I
don't think so! The only upgrade I may try is windows xp to see if it's
really as good as microsoft thinks.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cecil H. Whitley" <cwhitley@ec.rr.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 12:37 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> Hi,
> I've left your post intact. Just a couple comments about it. Prior to
> windows xp m.s. did not have a product which would provide speech while it
> was installing. Slackware has an out-of-the-box speech enabled install
and
> has for a while. There are list members here whom donate their time doing
> the same for redhat. Apparently that goes back a ways given the number of
> releases held on the speakup ftp site. I can't speak for other list
> members, but I try to answer all questions that I can (my knowledge base
is
> also limited). In at least one instance I have pointed a user to a
"howto",
> but that is because of my ignorance on the subject matter and I would
prefer
> to give accurate information as opposed to being overly helpfull and
> exceeding my knowledge base. Wrong answers do more damage than harm (at
> least in my opinion). Don't get me wrong, i'm not perfect nor is my
record.
> I do however try to clearly identify areas that are "guesses" as opposed
to
> "fact".
>
> At least with linux all the documentation is available on-line and in
fact,
> much of it comes with the distribution. That's why redhat has a cd
> dedicated to documentation. Linux, like windows is an extremely complex
set
> of various software packages. Your mileage may vary depending on the
> hardware you have and the choices you make in the installation process.
> apropos is a good command to remember as is man and info.
>
> In conclusion, if you want a stable gui environment with optional text
mode
> that doesn't crash several times a day, buy os/2! It's easy to setup and
> runs like a champ. It is however a bit dated.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cecil
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@home.ro>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 12:14 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> > Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux
by
> > myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many
things
> > about Linux.
> > In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could press
> the
> > "next" button and the system will be installed.
> > A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying to
> > install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors and
> they
> > were criptical for me.
> >
> > What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> > The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> > others.
> > They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> > Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> > The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just to
> get
> > the information I want.
> >
> > I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a few
> > months, but it is not my style of learning.
> >
> > I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
> >
> > This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> > telling me what's wrong.
> >
> > I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
> it...
> > It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> > They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think, but
I
> > should learn by manual and it is not my style.
> >
> > I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go to
> > http:// ....
> > I think you've got the idea.
> >
> > Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really try
> to
> > help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but
Linux
> > people don't have the time.
> >
> > Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some
> stupid
> > questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> > Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help from
> the
> > people who know, then why joining a list?
> > Just for pointing to a web page?
> > I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> > Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find with
a
> > single question and answer.
> >
> > I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time to
> read
> > them all.
> >
> > With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but
is
> > very hard to follow this way under Linux.
> >
> > Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
> >
> > Teddy,
> > orasnita@home.ro
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> > "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> > further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> > over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> > of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> > that other stuff go. You don't need it.
> >
> > On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think
that's
> > the
> > > problem.
> > > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use
pirated
> > > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that produces
> that
> > > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I
> won't
> > > use it. That's all.
> > >
> > > Teddy,
> > > orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in many
> > > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same provisions
> > > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > > access.
> > >
> > > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how one
> > > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > > might attract some unwanted attention.
> > >
> > > Brian.
> > >
> > >
> > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> > >
> > > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > >
> > > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > > >To speak, not to crack.
> > > >
> > > >Thank you for information.
> > > >Teddy,
> > > >orasnita@home.ro
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > > course, I
> > > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > > countries.
> > > >Greg
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > > >> *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> > Hey Igor,
> > > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After all,
> > > there
> > > >is
> > > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly over
> > > the
> > > >line
> > > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to see
> > > this
> > > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > > could
> > > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> Cecil Whitley
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >> Speakup mailing list
> > > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka, Director
> > Technology Research and Development
> > Governmental Relations Group
> > American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
> >
> > Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility SIG
> > Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> > http://www.openebook.org
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Alex Snow
@ ` Janina Sajka
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Janina Sajka @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
On Sun, 19 May 2002, Alex Snow wrote:
> The only upgrade I may try is windows xp to see if it's
> really as good as microsoft thinks.
If you do, think carefully before bringing it up on line.
Because, when you do, M$ will know the serial number of every
chip on your computer, and whether or not you have a license for
every piece of costware you've installed.
They're making a list, and checking it twice, and they're not
Santa Claus, though they have been known to play him on TV.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
` Janina Sajka
@ ` Adam Myrow
` Igor Gueths
` (2 more replies)
` possible sollution Maurice A. Mines
` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 3 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Adam Myrow @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Could you use something like Tiny Personal Firewall or Zone Alarm to block
Windows XP from sending out stuff? Or, would it start complaining that it
couldn't send "vital" information? I wouldn't expect Windows XP's own
firewall to block it, so it would surely be a third party one. Or, you
could put it behind a Linux box and have it block the crap it is trying to
send out. I had heard rumors about Windows XP doing this sort of stuff,
so that's why I've avoided it. I'm still dual booting with Windows 95.
Does Windows 2000 send out all your serial numbers and track you like
that?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
@ ` Igor Gueths
` David Poehlman
` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Igor Gueths @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi Adam. The tracking thing has been implemented only on Winxp. W2k doesn't use it. For w2k just get a Cd key from somewhere like Donkey.
----- Original Message -----
From: Adam Myrow <myrow@eskimo.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
> Could you use something like Tiny Personal Firewall or Zone Alarm to block
> Windows XP from sending out stuff? Or, would it start complaining that it
> couldn't send "vital" information? I wouldn't expect Windows XP's own
> firewall to block it, so it would surely be a third party one. Or, you
> could put it behind a Linux box and have it block the crap it is trying to
> send out. I had heard rumors about Windows XP doing this sort of stuff,
> so that's why I've avoided it. I'm still dual booting with Windows 95.
> Does Windows 2000 send out all your serial numbers and track you like
> that?
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
` Igor Gueths
@ ` David Poehlman
` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: David Poehlman @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
you can actually turn off all of the spy stuff which I have done with no
complaints. Yes, I use zone alarm and you can bet it blocks everything
I don't want send out.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Myrow" <myrow@eskimo.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
Could you use something like Tiny Personal Firewall or Zone Alarm to
block
Windows XP from sending out stuff? Or, would it start complaining that
it
couldn't send "vital" information? I wouldn't expect Windows XP's own
firewall to block it, so it would surely be a third party one. Or, you
could put it behind a Linux box and have it block the crap it is trying
to
send out. I had heard rumors about Windows XP doing this sort of stuff,
so that's why I've avoided it. I'm still dual booting with Windows 95.
Does Windows 2000 send out all your serial numbers and track you like
that?
_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: Windows XP spying (was possible sollution)
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
` Igor Gueths
` David Poehlman
@ ` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Shaun Oliver @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
zonealarm blocks anything it doesn't know what is.
it's a good little firewall as windows based firewalls go.
hth
--
Shaun Oliver
Man is the best computer we can put aboard a spacecraft ... and the
> > only one that can be mass produced with unskilled labor.
> > -- Wernher von Braun.
> > email: shaun_oliver@optusnet.com.au
> > icq:76958435
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Janina Sajka
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
@ ` Maurice A. Mines
` Janina Sajka
` Scott Howell
` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 2 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Maurice A. Mines @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
hi all this vary not trouw and please stop or I am gouing tto leave this
list !!!
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` possible sollution Maurice A. Mines
@ ` Janina Sajka
` Maurice A. Mines
` Scott Howell
1 sibling, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Janina Sajka @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Maurice:
You didn't include the message you were replying to, or provide
any explanation of what you're talking about. Do you mind trying
again?
On Mon, 20 May 2002, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> hi all this vary not trouw and please stop or I am gouing tto leave this
> list !!!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
--
Janina Sajka, Director
Technology Research and Development
Governmental Relations Group
American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
Chair, Accessibility SIG
Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
http://www.openebook.org
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Janina Sajka
@ ` Maurice A. Mines
` Erik Heil
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Maurice A. Mines @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
please??
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Maurice A. Mines
@ ` Erik Heil
` Igor Gueths
` Gregory Nowak
` Octavian Rasnita
2 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Erik Heil @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi,
Well, owuld you like to pay the prices for say JFW? If you think about it,
its a ripoff. I oculd go on with this line of thinking, but its not worth
it.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Maurice A. Mines" <mmines@mines-family.net>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 1:14 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> please??
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Erik Heil
@ ` Igor Gueths
` Octavian Rasnita
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Igor Gueths @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
As Erik said, I don't like to buy from companies like Microsucks and Freedom what is it again? who like to rip you off by selling you an overpriced operating system, or a 3.5 inch duel density floppy for $500.00? Get the point?
----- Original Message -----
From: Erik Heil <eheil@rcn.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 1:19 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> Hi,
> Well, owuld you like to pay the prices for say JFW? If you think about it,
> its a ripoff. I oculd go on with this line of thinking, but its not worth
> it.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Maurice A. Mines" <mmines@mines-family.net>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 1:14 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> > hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> > physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> > talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> > over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> > please??
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Igor Gueths
@ ` Octavian Rasnita
0 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Octavian Rasnita @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
500 dollars?
Where can you buy such a cheap version of Jaws?
The cheapest I know it was somewhere around 700 dollars.
The official price from Freedom ScienceFiction is 800 dollars.
Teddy,
orasnita@home.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@attbi.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 9:40 PM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
As Erik said, I don't like to buy from companies like Microsucks and Freedom
what is it again? who like to rip you off by selling you an overpriced
operating system, or a 3.5 inch duel density floppy for $500.00? Get the
point?
----- Original Message -----
From: Erik Heil <eheil@rcn.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 1:19 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> Hi,
> Well, owuld you like to pay the prices for say JFW? If you think about
it,
> its a ripoff. I oculd go on with this line of thinking, but its not worth
> it.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Maurice A. Mines" <mmines@mines-family.net>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 1:14 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> > hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> > physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> > talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> > over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> > please??
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Maurice A. Mines
` Erik Heil
@ ` Gregory Nowak
` Deedra Waters
` William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123
` Octavian Rasnita
2 siblings, 2 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Gregory Nowak @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hey, I know I'm bad sometimes, but why don't you check your spelling/typing? Also, as long as Kirk himself doesn't say windows bashing is not allowed on this list, I will with much pleasure continue to bash it when someone like Amir offends my GNU/Linux sensibilities by singing the praises of windows.
Greg
On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 05:14:13AM +0000, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> please??
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` Deedra Waters
` William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123
1 sibling, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Deedra Waters @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Greg, I get the impression that his english probably isn't verry good, why
not keep personal attacks off the list?:p
On Mon, 20 May 2002, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> Hey, I know I'm bad sometimes, but why don't you check your spelling/typing? Also, as long as Kirk himself doesn't say windows bashing is not allowed on this list, I will with much pleasure continue to bash it when someone like Amir offends my GNU/Linux sensibilities by singing the praises of windows.
> Greg
>
>
> On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 05:14:13AM +0000, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> > hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> > physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> > talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> > over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> > please??
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Gregory Nowak
` Deedra Waters
@ ` William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123
` Gregory Nowak
1 sibling, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123 @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi Gregg and all,
Maurice has a written expression disorder also known as Dysgraphia.
He's unable to map sounds to letters. It's so bad that even a
spell-checker doesn't help. If you read carefully, you should be able to
get the gist of what he's saying. If not, just ask for clarification.
Thanks in advance for your understanding.
Bill
On Mon, 20 May 2002, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> Hey, I know I'm bad sometimes, but why don't you check your
spelling/typing? Also, as long as Kirk himself doesn't say windows bashing is not allowed on this list, I will with much pleasure continue to bash it when someone like Amir offends my GNU/Linux sensibilities by singing the praises of windows.
> Greg
>
>
> On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 05:14:13AM +0000, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> > hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> > physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> > talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> > over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> > please??
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123
@ ` Gregory Nowak
0 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Gregory Nowak @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
I apologize. It's a comfort to know that I'm not the only one in the world who places judgement on others without knowing their circumstances.
Greg
On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 10:09:50PM -0600, William F. Acker WB2FLW +1-303-777-8123 wrote:
> Hi Gregg and all,
>
> Maurice has a written expression disorder also known as Dysgraphia.
> He's unable to map sounds to letters. It's so bad that even a
> spell-checker doesn't help. If you read carefully, you should be able to
> get the gist of what he's saying. If not, just ask for clarification.
>
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance for your understanding.
> Bill
>
>
> On Mon, 20 May 2002, Gregory Nowak wrote:
>
> > Hey, I know I'm bad sometimes, but why don't you check your
> spelling/typing? Also, as long as Kirk himself doesn't say windows bashing is not allowed on this list, I will with much pleasure continue to bash it when someone like Amir offends my GNU/Linux sensibilities by singing the praises of windows.
> > Greg
> >
> >
> > On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 05:14:13AM +0000, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> > > hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
> > > physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
> > > talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
> > > over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
> > > please??
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Maurice A. Mines
` Erik Heil
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` Octavian Rasnita
2 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Octavian Rasnita @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Yes, that is a very good idea.
BTW. If you don't want, please don't talk about pirating software. This may
be illegal in some countries including yours.
However, I don't know if it is illegal to talk only.
Regards.
Teddy,
orasnita@home.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Maurice A. Mines" <mmines@mines-family.net>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 20, 2002 8:14 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
hi I am talking about the windows bashing I use both linux andwindows my
physfpey is to use both and that both have the playse and please stope
talking about piritting software that is vay elicgle I gess I am filling
over welmed by email please let's just get back to talking about speakup
please??
_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` possible sollution Maurice A. Mines
` Janina Sajka
@ ` Scott Howell
1 sibling, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Scott Howell @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
what? da I didn't understand what you typed here.
On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 01:37:11AM +0000, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
> hi all this vary not trouw and please stop or I am gouing tto leave this
> list !!!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Janina Sajka
` Windows XP spying (was possible sollution) Adam Myrow
` possible sollution Maurice A. Mines
@ ` Shaun Oliver
2 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Shaun Oliver @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
please note my comments below.
--
Shaun Oliver
Man is the best computer we can put aboard a spacecraft ... and the
> > only one that can be mass produced with unskilled labor.
> > -- Wernher von Braun.
> > email: shaun_oliver@optusnet.com.au
> > icq:76958435
On Sun, 19 May 2002, Janina Sajka wrote:
> On Sun, 19 May 2002, Alex Snow wrote:
>
> > The only upgrade I may try is windows xp to see if it's
> > really as good as microsoft thinks.
>
>
>
> If you do, think carefully before bringing it up on line.
> Because, when you do, M$ will know the serial number of every
> chip on your computer, and whether or not you have a license for
> every piece of costware you've installed.
Janina, from what I understand with all due respect, microsoft will only
know about their operating system and not too much more than that.
If however, I'm wrong, then that's fine I'll stand up and say so.
Having said that however, I think that it's that sort of scare mungering
that make microsoft the overbaring monopoly it is today.
This spying however, will only be a problem is people register the thing
over the net as I understand it.
>
> They're making a list, and checking it twice, and they're not
> Santa Claus, though they have been known to play him on TV.
Oh my god. please enlighten meI don't think we've had those vissions over
here in australia.
haha
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
` Cecil H. Whitley
@ ` Gregory Nowak
` Shaun Oliver
` Alex Snow
` brian Moore
` (3 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 2 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Gregory Nowak @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 07:14:16AM +0300, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> telling me what's wrong.
>
> I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve it...
> It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
I suppose that when you get an illegal operation error in windblows, you know exactly what it means and what you should do to correct it in the future?
Greg
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` Shaun Oliver
` Alex Snow
1 sibling, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Shaun Oliver @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
why are we even having this discussion?
a seg fault or illegal operation is simply due to a program trying to
exceed it's memory allocation for whatever reason.
if you don't have the source code or for that matter know what to do about
it, why are you even worrying about it.
all I know is that when an illegal operation on windblows ocurs 9 times
out of 10, it takes the whole os down with it thus causing a stack dump.
or core dump.
why? how the bloody hell should I know? it's windows we're not supposed to
know. We're just expected to run the thing and not cry about it. or, pay
big dollars for some snot nosed little brat to tell what you already knew
in the first place.
--
Shaun Oliver
Man is the best computer we can put aboard a spacecraft ... and the
> > only one that can be mass produced with unskilled labor.
> > -- Wernher von Braun.
> > email: shaun_oliver@optusnet.com.au
> > icq:76958435
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Gregory Nowak
` Shaun Oliver
@ ` Alex Snow
1 sibling, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Alex Snow @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Yeah, all you have to do is through your computer out the window because a
broken computer is worth more than a computer running winblows.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 1:05 AM
Subject: Re: possible sollution
> On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 07:14:16AM +0300, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> > telling me what's wrong.
> >
> > I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
it...
> > It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
>
> I suppose that when you get an illegal operation error in windblows, you
know exactly what it means and what you should do to correct it in the
future?
> Greg
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
` Cecil H. Whitley
` Gregory Nowak
@ ` brian Moore
` Ann Parsons
` (2 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: brian Moore @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
if you have a redhat system, it is full of step by step guides for
doing things. these are not complete manuals but do this and then do
that short documents to make things happen if downloading linux is a
major hassle for you, send me your address and I will burn cds of any
distrobution you like and I will send them.
brian
*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
On 5/19/02 at 7:14 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux
by
>myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many
things
>about Linux.
>In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could
press the
>"next" button and the system will be installed.
>A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying
to
>install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors
and they
>were criptical for me.
>
>What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
>The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
>others.
>They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
>Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
>The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just
to get
>the information I want.
>
>I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a
few
>months, but it is not my style of learning.
>
>I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
>
>This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error
message
>telling me what's wrong.
>
>I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve
it...
>It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
>They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think,
but I
>should learn by manual and it is not my style.
>
>I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go
to
>http:// ....
>I think you've got the idea.
>
>Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really
try to
>help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but
Linux
>people don't have the time.
>
>Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some
stupid
>questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
>Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help
from the
>people who know, then why joining a list?
>Just for pointing to a web page?
>I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
>Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find
with a
>single question and answer.
>
>I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time
to read
>them all.
>
>With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but
is
>very hard to follow this way under Linux.
>
>Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
>
>Teddy,
>orasnita@home.ro
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
>To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
>Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
>This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
>"solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
>further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
>over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
>of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
>that other stuff go. You don't need it.
>
>On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>
>> Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think
that's
>the
>> problem.
>> In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use
pirated
>> software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
>> So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that
produces that
>> software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I
won't
>> use it. That's all.
>>
>> Teddy,
>> orasnita@home.ro
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
>> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>> Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
>> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>>
>>
>> our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in
many
>> respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
>> bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same
provisions
>> which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
>> access.
>>
>> I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how
one
>> might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
>> might attract some unwanted attention.
>>
>> Brian.
>>
>>
>> *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
>>
>> On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>>
>> >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
>> >To speak, not to crack.
>> >
>> >Thank you for information.
>> >Teddy,
>> >orasnita@home.ro
>> >
>> >----- Original Message -----
>> >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
>> >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>> >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
>> >Subject: Re: possible sollution
>> >
>> >
>> >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
>> course, I
>> >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
>> countries.
>> >Greg
>> >
>> >
>> >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
>> >> *snip*
>> >>
>> >> > Hey Igor,
>> >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
>> >>
>> >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After
all,
>> there
>> >is
>> >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly
over
>> the
>> >line
>> >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to
see
>> this
>> >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
>> could
>> >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Cecil Whitley
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Speakup mailing list
>> >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >Speakup mailing list
>> >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >Speakup mailing list
>> >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>
>--
>
>Janina Sajka, Director
>Technology Research and Development
>Governmental Relations Group
>American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
>
>Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
>
>Chair, Accessibility SIG
>Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
>http://www.openebook.org
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Speakup mailing list
>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
` brian Moore
@ ` Ann Parsons
` Kenny Hitt
` Charles Crawford
5 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Ann Parsons @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi all,
OK, Teddy. I learn this way too. It is very hard to read a manual if
you do not understand what you are reading. The best way to start
learning is ask a simple question. When you get the answer to that
question, go to the next question.
Decide what you want to do and then ask your questions.
<smile> Yes, the man pages are terrible. I hated man pages when I
first started, but they become more understandable the more you learn.
Ann P.
--
Ann K. Parsons
email: akp@eznet.net ICQ Number: 33006854
WEB SITE: http://home.eznet.net/~akp
"All that is gold does not glitter. Not all those who wander are lost." JRRT
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
` (3 preceding siblings ...)
` Ann Parsons
@ ` Kenny Hitt
` Scott Howell
` Charles Crawford
5 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Kenny Hitt @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
First: How did you know when to select nest in Windows when You can't
install a screen reader until after you install Windows?
Second: When people tell you to go to a web sight, they are
telling you where to find help for your problem. If you're to
stupid or lazy to bother learning, that is your fault.
Third: All the distributions I've tried have the same aproach
during their install. Mainly, if you don't know just press
enter and the install program will make a choice for you.
Kenny
On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 07:14:16AM +0300, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux by
> myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many things
> about Linux.
> In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could press the
> "next" button and the system will be installed.
> A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying to
> install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors and they
> were criptical for me.
>
> What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> others.
> They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just to get
> the information I want.
>
> I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a few
> months, but it is not my style of learning.
>
> I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
>
> This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> telling me what's wrong.
>
> I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve it...
> It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think, but I
> should learn by manual and it is not my style.
>
> I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go to
> http:// ....
> I think you've got the idea.
>
> Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really try to
> help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but Linux
> people don't have the time.
>
> Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some stupid
> questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help from the
> people who know, then why joining a list?
> Just for pointing to a web page?
> I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find with a
> single question and answer.
>
> I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time to read
> them all.
>
> With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but is
> very hard to follow this way under Linux.
>
> Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
>
> Teddy,
> orasnita@home.ro
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> Subject: Re: possible sollution
>
>
> This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> that other stuff go. You don't need it.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>
> > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think that's
> the
> > problem.
> > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use pirated
> > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that produces that
> > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I won't
> > use it. That's all.
> >
> > Teddy,
> > orasnita@home.ro
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in many
> > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same provisions
> > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > access.
> >
> > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how one
> > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > might attract some unwanted attention.
> >
> > Brian.
> >
> >
> > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> >
> > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> >
> > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > >To speak, not to crack.
> > >
> > >Thank you for information.
> > >Teddy,
> > >orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > course, I
> > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > countries.
> > >Greg
> > >
> > >
> > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > >> *snip*
> > >>
> > >> > Hey Igor,
> > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > >>
> > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After all,
> > there
> > >is
> > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly over
> > the
> > >line
> > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to see
> > this
> > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > could
> > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >>
> > >> Cecil Whitley
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Speakup mailing list
> > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >Speakup mailing list
> > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >_______________________________________________
> > >Speakup mailing list
> > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> --
>
> Janina Sajka, Director
> Technology Research and Development
> Governmental Relations Group
> American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
>
> Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
>
> Chair, Accessibility SIG
> Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> http://www.openebook.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Kenny Hitt
@ ` Scott Howell
` Will Smith
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Scott Howell @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
You know I really hate winers. I hate those who not only are to damned
lazy to read, but those who will even admitt their to lazy to read. They
act as though their time is so valuable they can't be bothered even
making some attempt at solving the problem. Well all I can say is piss
off and don't ask any questions until you make some attempt to help
yourself. I also hate when fuck stick people use this forum to single
out someone for their tirades. This really could have been handled off
list unless your ranting against those idiots in general.
I hate lazy people as much as the next person.
On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 12:07:29PM -0500, Kenny Hitt wrote:
> First: How did you know when to select nest in Windows when You can't
> install a screen reader until after you install Windows?
> Second: When people tell you to go to a web sight, they are
> telling you where to find help for your problem. If you're to
> stupid or lazy to bother learning, that is your fault.
> Third: All the distributions I've tried have the same aproach
> during their install. Mainly, if you don't know just press
> enter and the install program will make a choice for you.
> Kenny
>
> On Sun, May 19, 2002 at 07:14:16AM +0300, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > Yes I thought the same but I've discovered that I can't install Linux by
> > myself, without sighted help, especially if I don't know too many things
> > about Linux.
> > In Windows, even somebody don't know too many things, they could press the
> > "next" button and the system will be installed.
> > A friend installed me Red Hat, and there were some errors when trying to
> > install it. He solved the problem, but he also read me those errors and they
> > were criptical for me.
> >
> > What I don't like under Linux is that there is no help for newbies.
> > The people that know very much don't want to lose their times to teach
> > others.
> > They simply point to a web site, and that's all.
> > Well, I am not online all the time because I am on dial up.
> > The other manuals are only text format, and I should read a lot just to get
> > the information I want.
> >
> > I know, linux is very easy to use if you stay and read manuals for a few
> > months, but it is not my style of learning.
> >
> > I like the trial and fail by example way of learning.
> >
> > This is not very easy under Linux because I don't see any error message
> > telling me what's wrong.
> >
> > I can see "segmentation fault" and I don't know what can I do to solve it...
> > It is the same with the error messages from the log files.
> > They tell more than the error messages from under Windows, I think, but I
> > should learn by manual and it is not my style.
> >
> > I've tried learning from some lists, and almost all the help was "go to
> > http:// ....
> > I think you've got the idea.
> >
> > Well, I've made some lists on Yahoogroups for the blind and I really try to
> > help the people telling them step by step how to do some things, but Linux
> > people don't have the time.
> >
> > Even that friend that installed me Linux told me that if he sees some stupid
> > questions on a list, he doesn't answer because he loses his time.
> > Well, he is right, but if the people who don't know can't find help from the
> > people who know, then why joining a list?
> > Just for pointing to a web page?
> > I know to search with Google and I can find a lot of information about
> > Linux, but it will take me a lot of time to find what I could find with a
> > single question and answer.
> >
> > I have a lot of books about Linux and Unix but I don't have the time to read
> > them all.
> >
> > With my way of learning, I've learned a lot of things for Windows, but is
> > very hard to follow this way under Linux.
> >
> > Maybe I should change my way ... If I can.
> >
> > Teddy,
> > orasnita@home.ro
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@afb.net>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 5:56 AM
> > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> >
> >
> > This is ridiculous. What do you mean you don't have another
> > "solution?" You have Linux, right? Why would you even want to go
> > further? Why would you bother to waste time compromising yourself
> > over some technology that doesn't even care about you? What kind
> > of a masochist are you, anyway? Stand up for yourself, and let
> > that other stuff go. You don't need it.
> >
> > On Sun, 19 May 2002, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you. So the people don't want the others attention. I think that's
> > the
> > > problem.
> > > In some countries, it is something very bad to crack or to use pirated
> > > software, but in others, the computer users have no other solution.
> > > So if I can't afford to buy something, than the company that produces that
> > > software don't lose anything anyway, because if I don't steal it, I won't
> > > use it. That's all.
> > >
> > > Teddy,
> > > orasnita@home.ro
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "brian Moore" <admin@bmoore.yi.org>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 6:58 AM
> > > Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > >
> > >
> > > our copy right laws in Canada are not significantly different in many
> > > respects than those in the u.s. this is one of my gripes with
> > > bookshare abut that is a separate issue. we have the same provisions
> > > which allow for alternate format distribution but we still can't get
> > > access.
> > >
> > > I am no copy right lawyer but I would suspect that discussing how one
> > > might by pass a copy protection system is not strictly illegal, it
> > > might attract some unwanted attention.
> > >
> > > Brian.
> > >
> > >
> > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
> > >
> > > On 5/18/02 at 5:50 AM Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> > >
> > > >Is illegal in Canada to speak about cracks?
> > > >To speak, not to crack.
> > > >
> > > >Thank you for information.
> > > >Teddy,
> > > >orasnita@home.ro
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > >From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romualt.dhs.org>
> > > >To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > >Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2002 3:34 AM
> > > >Subject: Re: possible sollution
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I agree. However, this list is on a machine in Canada. So ... Of
> > > course, I
> > > >don't know what the differences in such laws are between the 2
> > > countries.
> > > >Greg
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >On Fri, May 17, 2002 at 08:30:51PM -0400, Cecil H. Whitley wrote:
> > > >> *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> > Hey Igor,
> > > >> > What you may want to look at is just doing a dump *snip*
> > > >>
> > > >> Can you please cease and desist with this on this list? After all,
> > > there
> > > >is
> > > >> a DMCA for us here in the u.s. This thread is quite possibly over
> > > the
> > > >line
> > > >> of what is legal within this country. I for one do not wish to see
> > > this
> > > >> list banned and the site blocked and I assume that either or both
> > > could
> > > >> occur within the u.s. Your cooperation is appreciated.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> Cecil Whitley
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >> Speakup mailing list
> > > >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
> > > >Speakup mailing list
> > > >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka, Director
> > Technology Research and Development
> > Governmental Relations Group
> > American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
> >
> > Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
> >
> > Chair, Accessibility SIG
> > Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
> > http://www.openebook.org
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Scott Howell
@ ` Will Smith
` Scott Howell
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Will Smith @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hi Scott,
Good! Now we know what you hate. So how's about telling us what you can
do to give and receive help on this list?
Or is listing your pet peeves supposed to be helpful? (smile)
Will
wilsmith@iglou.com
P. S. As a former high school teacher let me tell you that you will never
be able to shame a lazy student into working harder. Other methods might
work, but that one never does!
On Mon, 20 May 2002, Scott Howell wrote:
>
> You know I really hate winers. I hate those who not only are to damned
> lazy to read, but those who will even admitt their to lazy to read. They
etc.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Will Smith
@ ` Scott Howell
` Buddy Brannan
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Scott Howell @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Fyi bud, I've provided help and have been here a while. If I want to
rant on occation then so be it just hit delete.
I had my say and your reply was of no value I'm through with this
thread.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Scott Howell
@ ` Buddy Brannan
` Janina Sajka
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Buddy Brannan @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
On Tue, May 21, 2002 at 06:23:55PM -0400, Scott Howell wrote:
> Fyi bud, I've provided help and have been here a while. If I want to
> rant on occation then so be it just hit delete.
Speaking of ranting...I'm really getting tired of y'all people using
blaming me for everything! I haven't even posted on this thread once,
and I can think of three times that I've been saying things I haven't
come anywhere near close to saying. Hint: I'm Buddy. He's Teddy (or
Octavian, or whoever he is).
Yeah, just kidding. Sheesh people!
--
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV/3 | I choose you to take up all of my time.
Email: davros@ycardz.com | I choose you because you're funny and kind
| I want easy people from now on.
| --the Nields
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Buddy Brannan
@ ` Janina Sajka
` Buddy Brannan
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Janina Sajka @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
Hey, Buddy:
I used the word "buddy," with Octavian once. I didn't mean you,
though. I meant it in lower case, sort of like generic, you know.
Sorry if you thought I meant you.
On Tue, 21 May 2002, Buddy Brannan wrote:
> On Tue, May 21, 2002 at 06:23:55PM -0400, Scott Howell wrote:
> > Fyi bud, I've provided help and have been here a while. If I want to
> > rant on occation then so be it just hit delete.
>
> Speaking of ranting...I'm really getting tired of y'all people using
> blaming me for everything! I haven't even posted on this thread once,
> and I can think of three times that I've been saying things I haven't
> come anywhere near close to saying. Hint: I'm Buddy. He's Teddy (or
> Octavian, or whoever he is).
>
> Yeah, just kidding. Sheesh people!
>
--
Janina Sajka, Director
Technology Research and Development
Governmental Relations Group
American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
Chair, Accessibility SIG
Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
http://www.openebook.org
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Janina Sajka
@ ` Buddy Brannan
` Janina Sajka
0 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Buddy Brannan @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
On Tue, May 21, 2002 at 11:29:24PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Hey, Buddy:
>
> I used the word "buddy," with Octavian once. I didn't mean you,
> though. I meant it in lower case, sort of like generic, you know.
*LOL*...OK, sorry, I knew that, but it was my poor attempt at levity. Seems to me things are getting a little tense around these here parts. ...
--
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV/3 | I choose you to take up all of my time.
Email: davros@ycardz.com | I choose you because you're funny and kind
| I want easy people from now on.
| --the Nields
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Buddy Brannan
@ ` Janina Sajka
0 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Janina Sajka @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
On Wed, 22 May 2002, Buddy Brannan wrote:
> *LOL*...OK, sorry, I knew that, but it was my poor attempt at levity. Seems to me things are getting a little tense around these here parts. ...
>
Yeah. So it seems. I know about me. I'm tired and crabby from too
much traveling and too much work. I need a vacation. Next week.
Bring on next week. Then, maybe I'll be better at suffering fools
gladly.
--
Janina Sajka, Director
Technology Research and Development
Governmental Relations Group
American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
Chair, Accessibility SIG
Open Electronic Book Forum (OEBF)
http://www.openebook.org
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread
* Re: possible sollution
` Octavian Rasnita
` (4 preceding siblings ...)
` Kenny Hitt
@ ` Charles Crawford
` Deedra Waters
5 siblings, 1 reply; 63+ messages in thread
From: Charles Crawford @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: speakup
I think the points made about help for new folks with Linix are on point
for many. I hope those tutorials get done soon. Understanding the system
from the guts up and getting practice with tutored commands and apps will
help many including myself.
-- charlie.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread* Re: possible sollution
` Charles Crawford
@ ` Deedra Waters
0 siblings, 0 replies; 63+ messages in thread
From: Deedra Waters @ UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Charles Crawford; +Cc: speakup
I think that tutorials will help a lot. It's mor interactive then just
sitting and reading in the sense that hopefully their easier to follow,
and easier to understand, and if they work like most tutorials I've seen
do, then you can just follow along with the examples given in the
tutorial.
On Sun, 19 May 2002, Charles Crawford wrote:
> I think the points made about help for new folks with Linix are on point
> for many. I hope those tutorials get done soon. Understanding the system
> from the guts up and getting practice with tutored commands and apps will
> help many including myself.
>
> -- charlie.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 63+ messages in thread