changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[cris]

Hi Folks,
How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
Cheers,
Cris

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
the options and what they are set to.
It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
alot of cases.
If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
depend on.




----- Original Message -----
From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


Hi Folks,
How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
Cheers,
Cris
_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Igor Gueths]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Or if you have the cash for it...A pc-Weasel card.
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> the options and what they are set to.
> It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> alot of cases.
> If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> depend on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> Hi Folks,
> How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> Cheers,
> Cris
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[hank smith]

what is a pc weasal card?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 8:24 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Or if you have the cash for it...A pc-Weasel card.
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFAU95rNohoaf1zXJMRAmpXAJ9t2+JTe5H3tZaBwpEg91ceCf6W9ACfa9IY
> SFnFRH43AvIdWiVoDLuWQsE=
> =BsLO
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Angelo Sonnesso]

What is a pc-Weasel card?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 11:24 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Or if you have the cash for it...A pc-Weasel card.
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFAU95rNohoaf1zXJMRAmpXAJ9t2+JTe5H3tZaBwpEg91ceCf6W9ACfa9IY
> SFnFRH43AvIdWiVoDLuWQsE=
> =BsLO
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Shaun Oliver]

a pc weasle card is a card that allows one to capture the screen and 
keyboard input and either have it sent to another computer for 
controlling purposes or over a network for remote access.
this allows one to see the messages right from post to shutdown.
the problem inharent with this is that the screen reader reads all of 
the screen. the good thing about this is the screen reader reads all of 
the screen.
that doesn't make sense to most people but if you look at it like this.
no review functions and no way of stopping the process.
maybe you'll have review functions on the pc acting as the terminal 
 but they're not going to be of much use until you're in the bios.
for a look at the pc weasle card in action or to at least get the specs 
on it, look at the below site.
http://www.realweasel.com/pcivga.html
that's for the pci/vga model.
or for the old monocrome model,
http://www.realweasel.com/
hth

-- 
Shaun Oliver


"I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person."
email: shaun_oliver@optusnet.com.au
WEB: http://blindman.homelinux.org/~blindman/
IRC: irc.awesomechat.net:6666
IRCNICK: blindman

-- 
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
MailScanner thanks transtec Computers for their support.

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Doug Sutherland]

http://www.realweasel.com/intro.html

 > a pc weasle card is ...

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Janina Sajka]

If you have a external speech synthesizer with a parallel port--like the Litetalk--you can hit print screen during bios and hear all the text that's on screen. In fact, this is why I have a Litetalk. Doing this was important in my life about a decade ago.

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[hank smith]

w do you get it to tell you what it is doing with the print screen?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 6:40 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> If you have a external speech synthesizer with a parallel port--like the
Litetalk--you can hit print screen during bios and hear all the text that's
on screen. In fact, this is why I have a Litetalk. Doing this was important
in my life about a decade ago.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean McMahon]

Great maybe!  I have a Braillelite which has a paralel port, can I make that
talk out the paralel port with printscreen?  Of course as a synth this is
normally cerial device.
Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 7:40 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> If you have a external speech synthesizer with a parallel port--like the
Litetalk--you can hit print screen during bios and hear all the text that's on
screen. In fact, this is why I have a Litetalk. Doing this was important in my
life about a decade ago.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[hank smith]

that is what I am wanting to know as well.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Angelo Sonnesso" <asonnesso@gemdayservices.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 11:34 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> What is a pc-Weasel card?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 11:24 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Or if you have the cash for it...A pc-Weasel card.
> > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does
work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help
to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
> >
> > iD8DBQFAU95rNohoaf1zXJMRAmpXAJ9t2+JTe5H3tZaBwpEg91ceCf6W9ACfa9IY
> > SFnFRH43AvIdWiVoDLuWQsE=
> > =BsLO
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Igor Gueths]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Basically its a card that can emulate a monochrome monitor and I think a 
keyboard/mouse. Check it out at www.realweasel.com
On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 02:34:13AM -0500, Angelo Sonnesso wrote:
> What is a pc-Weasel card?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 11:24 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Or if you have the cash for it...A pc-Weasel card.
> > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
> >
> > iD8DBQFAU95rNohoaf1zXJMRAmpXAJ9t2+JTe5H3tZaBwpEg91ceCf6W9ACfa9IY
> > SFnFRH43AvIdWiVoDLuWQsE=
> > =BsLO
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

Since the blazer can also speak whatever comes in through its parallel
port, you theoretically wouldn't need lots of paper.

I'll have to try this some time to see if it works. I assume the
print screen key on the keyboard is used to issue the print screen
command?

Greg

P.S. My machines here all have Award BIOSes, anyone know if this works
for a fact with Award BIOSes?


On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> the options and what they are set to.
> It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> alot of cases.
> If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> depend on.
> 
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Igor Gueths]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Although wouldn't you have to have some osrt of parallel to serial 
adapter plugged into the parallel port of the Blazer, since the print 
screen command won't send output to the serial port? 
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 10:38:22PM -0600, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> Since the blazer can also speak whatever comes in through its parallel
> port, you theoretically wouldn't need lots of paper.
> 
> I'll have to try this some time to see if it works. I assume the
> print screen key on the keyboard is used to issue the print screen
> command?
> 
> Greg
> 
> P.S. My machines here all have Award BIOSes, anyone know if this works
> for a fact with Award BIOSes?
> 
> 
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> -- 
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

No. If the print screen command sends output to the first parallel
port on the pc, you'd just need to plug a parallel cable from the pc
to the blazer, set the blazer to speak whatever comes through the
parallel port, and you should in theory be all set.

Greg


On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 12:19:12AM -0500, Igor Gueths wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Although wouldn't you have to have some osrt of parallel to serial 
> adapter plugged into the parallel port of the Blazer, since the print 
> screen command won't send output to the serial port? 

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[cris]

Hi folks,
In the old days, There used to be a version of wordperfect 5.1 that ran on
unix, which I assume it would also run on linux!  This version no longer is
available on the internet for download.  You can find wordperfect versions 8
and above for linux, but those ones require xwindows.  If anyone have found
or managed to still have the version of wordperfect that can run only in a
txt consol, please pass me a copy.  I need wordperfect because I need a
linux word processor that does footnotes, italics, boldfacing, and some
other important features of professional academic papers.
Cheers,
Cris

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[zorkmed]

I too would be interested ins wp, I liked the way it ran on dos.

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[hank smith]

if you could send it to me once you get it it would be cool
----- Original Message -----
From: <zorkmed@comcast.net>
To: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>; "Speakup is a screen review system for
Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 12:30 PM
Subject: Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?


> I too would be interested ins wp, I liked the way it ran on dos.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Karen Lewellen]

I would love it too, but
why would the editions of wordperfect
currently out there for Linux require windows??
sounds like  bad program writing to me.
Karen
<who still uses wordperfect on this machine.


On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, hank smith wrote:

> if you could send it to me once you get it it would be cool
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <zorkmed@comcast.net>
> To: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>; "Speakup is a screen review system for
> Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 12:30 PM
> Subject: Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?
>
>
> > I too would be interested ins wp, I liked the way it ran on dos.
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Krister Ekstrom]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Karen,

On 19 Mar 2004 16:06:34  (my local time 23:06:34), you typed::
KL> why would the editions of wordperfect
KL> currently out there for Linux require windows??

I think he means X-Windows, the GUI environment for Linux, but doesn't
it run in text mode too? If so, i would definitely love to have a copy
of the latest WP.

- --
/Krister
crisekstrom@bredband.net
 Get pgp keys here: mailto:crisekstrom@bredband.net?subject=get_pgp_keys
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Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

Hi, Cris.
I doubt you can get your hands on a WP 5.1 for Linux, but there are
alternatives to this. I am thinking of three of them right off of the top of
my head.

1. Download OpenOffice.org 1.1 from OpenOffice.org and get and install the
java-access-bridge for gnome.  After you configure everything right you can
get some use out of OpenOffice, but it has a long ways to go before it works
as well as Windows based wordprocessors.
2. You can purchase StarOffice 7, but it doesn't work that much better than
OpenOffice with gnopernicus.
3. Learn a markup language such as xml or html which is totally text based,
and works in any text editor you like.
I would choose xml as many computer manuals such as the Mandrake users
guides are written in xml, and printed out looking as good as if not better
than a high priced wordprocessor like MS Word.
It is simply a matter of learning xml, and learning on how to make the
document look good.
Hth.

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

what about running wp 5.1 for dos in dosemu?
On Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at 
10:22:59PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> Hi, Cris.
> I doubt you can get your hands on a WP 5.1 for Linux, but there are
> alternatives to this. I am thinking of three of them right off of the top of
> my head.
> 
> 1. Download OpenOffice.org 1.1 from OpenOffice.org and get and install the
> java-access-bridge for gnome.  After you configure everything right you can
> get some use out of OpenOffice, but it has a long ways to go before it works
> as well as Windows based wordprocessors.
> 2. You can purchase StarOffice 7, but it doesn't work that much better than
> OpenOffice with gnopernicus.
> 3. Learn a markup language such as xml or html which is totally text based,
> and works in any text editor you like.
> I would choose xml as many computer manuals such as the Mandrake users
> guides are written in xml, and printed out looking as good as if not better
> than a high priced wordprocessor like MS Word.
> It is simply a matter of learning xml, and learning on how to make the
> document look good.
> Hth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

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=q1Zr
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

That works fine. I've done that in the past, and I still have a copy of wp51
for dos laying around my office somewhere. Although, I have moved on to
markup languages, and if I am really in a hurry I use Openoffice 1.1 and
gnopernicus.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Snow" <alex_snow@gmx.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 9:22 AM
Subject: Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> what about running wp 5.1 for dos in dosemu?
> On Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at
> 10:22:59PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > Hi, Cris.
> > I doubt you can get your hands on a WP 5.1 for Linux, but there are
> > alternatives to this. I am thinking of three of them right off of the
top of
> > my head.
> >
> > 1. Download OpenOffice.org 1.1 from OpenOffice.org and get and install
the
> > java-access-bridge for gnome.  After you configure everything right you
can
> > get some use out of OpenOffice, but it has a long ways to go before it
works
> > as well as Windows based wordprocessors.
> > 2. You can purchase StarOffice 7, but it doesn't work that much better
than
> > OpenOffice with gnopernicus.
> > 3. Learn a markup language such as xml or html which is totally text
based,
> > and works in any text editor you like.
> > I would choose xml as many computer manuals such as the Mandrake users
> > guides are written in xml, and printed out looking as good as if not
better
> > than a high priced wordprocessor like MS Word.
> > It is simply a matter of learning xml, and learning on how to make the
> > document look good.
> > Hth.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> - --
> Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
> back.
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFAXFOL9XVrM3ri110RAij7AJ9ssXWJQpUSFgSzWxr96GUr6vLegACePXBH
> Tfcl+Imxro0y8Q1+Rfm5qEM=
> =q1Zr
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Markup languages, was Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Krister Ekstrom]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tom,

On 19 Mar 2004 22:22:59  (my local time 20 mar 2004 05:22:59), you
typed::
TaEW> 3. Learn a markup language such as xml or html which is totally text based,
TaEW> and works in any text editor you like.

What's the difference between XML and Html? Is XMl harder to learn?
and wasn't there a set of tools that could in a sort of automagic way
make HTML, XML and other markup languages files?


- --
/Krister
crisekstrom@bredband.net
 Get pgp keys here: mailto:crisekstrom@bredband.net?subject=get_pgp_keys
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.2-nr2 (Windows XP)

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Ov8KRXxd3cJ2JMEMwXGkvUY=
=UfF9
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Markup languages

[Saqib Shaikh]

IMHO there are 7 markup languages that are commonly used:

1.  HTML
HTML is used for the WWW.  Allows very simple formatting (such as bold,
italic, underline, centre), and linking to other documents.

2.  SGML
SGML is a more generic markup language than HTML.  Alongside SGML you need a
document type definition (DTD) to specify the rules of that document's
markup.  So there is a DTD for HTML which specifies what tags can be used
and what they achieve.  Another common DTD for SGML is DocBook.  DocBook is
great - it specifies a lot more than HTML, including figures, table of
contents, revision histories etc.

3.  XML
XML can be considered the successor to SGML.  Again you have a template
which specifies the rules for a document.  For example Microsoft now have
their own template, and there is also a template for DocBook.

4.  Trof
I don't know much about this other than it is the traditional Unix markup
language.

5.  RTF
This is output by many word processors, but is surprisingly easy to write by
hand.  It is also an open standard unlike Word files.

6.  LaTeX
LaTeX is a set of macros to make TeX easier to use.  It is great for writing
reports and has great mathematical functionality.  It is the only way that I
know for a blind person to write printed maths.

7.  Lout
Lout is an attempt to make LaTeX more modern and easier to use, but it
hasn't really taken off.

In summary each of these methods has a set syntax for writing documents, and
then you use a program to convert them to other formats like PDF,
Postscript, ASCII, HTML and RTF.

My personal preference goes to HTML for writing web pages (obviously), LaTeX
for writing printed reports/assignments, and Docbook/XML for large documents
to be published electronically.

Hope this helps somewhat - I necessarily simplified a lot.

Saqib

Re: Markup languages, was Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

Hi.
Html is a markup language developed for the internet. It's tagging is very
simple for basic bolding, italics, linking to other documents, other web
sites.  However, while a good markup language it is not great for real heavy
document writing.
Xml is primarily used  for large documents such as manuals, users guides,
and college papers.
One of the great things about xml is that docbook has tools for converting
xml in to other file formats like pdf documents or postscript for a printer,
and other formats. That is one thing other markup languages like html can
not do.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Krister Ekstrom" <crisekstrom@bredband.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 5:50 AM
Subject: Markup languages,was Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1
for linux?


-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tom,

On 19 Mar 2004 22:22:59  (my local time 20 mar 2004 05:22:59), you
typed::
TaEW> 3. Learn a markup language such as xml or html which is totally text
based,
TaEW> and works in any text editor you like.

What's the difference between XML and Html? Is XMl harder to learn?
and wasn't there a set of tools that could in a sort of automagic way
make HTML, XML and other markup languages files?


- --
/Krister
crisekstrom@bredband.net
 Get pgp keys here: mailto:crisekstrom@bredband.net?subject=get_pgp_keys
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.2-nr2 (Windows XP)

iD8DBQFAbpb1ODlJeoMTOQsRA4e9AJ9KFia0u1wjbelfKEy1TKNjtnAJ+QCfaHPc
Ov8KRXxd3cJ2JMEMwXGkvUY=
=UfF9
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----



_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Does anyone have a copy of WordPerfect 5.1 for linux?

[Shaun Oliver]

I wouldn't mind a copy me self just to play with.

-- 
Shaun Oliver


"I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person."
email: shaun.oliver@optusnet.com.au
WEB: http://blindman.homelinux.org/~blindman/
IRC: irc.awesomechat.net:6666
IRCNICK: blindman

-- 
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
MailScanner thanks transtec Computers for their support.

Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Bob Dodd]

Apple have just launched a spoken interface for Mac OS X. It seems very
"Speakup" in its approach (maybe not so surprosing when you think what
OS X is derived from). It would be great to do a comparision of the two
platforms, partly to see what they've missed, and partly to see what
Speakup can learn from it. Anyone have a Mac capable of running OS X?

The link to Apple's annonucement is: 
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/

/bob dodd

__________________________________
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RE: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Saqib Shaikh]

I don't really understand why SpokenInterface is like Speakup - can you
explain?

Thanks, Saqib
 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca [mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
On Behalf Of Bob Dodd
Sent: 20 March 2004 10:46
To: speakup@braille.uwo.ca
Subject: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

Apple have just launched a spoken interface for Mac OS X. It seems very
"Speakup" in its approach (maybe not so surprosing when you think what OS X
is derived from). It would be great to do a comparision of the two
platforms, partly to see what they've missed, and partly to see what Speakup
can learn from it. Anyone have a Mac capable of running OS X?

The link to Apple's annonucement is: 
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/

/bob dodd

__________________________________
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_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[David Poehlman]

>From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 5:45 AM
Subject: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


Apple have just launched a spoken interface for Mac OS X. It seems very
"Speakup" in its approach (maybe not so surprosing when you think what
OS X is derived from). It would be great to do a comparision of the two
platforms, partly to see what they've missed, and partly to see what
Speakup can learn from it. Anyone have a Mac capable of running OS X?

The link to Apple's annonucement is: 
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/

/bob dodd

__________________________________
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http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

_______________________________________________
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Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Bob Dodd]

No it hasn;t. Currently they are looking for beta testers I believe:
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/questionnaire.html

I'm not sure how many beta testers they think they will get, since I
don't imagine there are many visually impaired users that currently
have macs...

/bob

--- David Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.
> 


__________________________________
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Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
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Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[David Poehlman]

There are quite a few potential beta candidates out there.  I am one of them
who has a titanium g4 powerbook running osx but the only way I can currently
use it is with os9 and outspoken for the mac.  There are lots of people for
one reason or another who are currently not working in some places because
there is no screen reading access to osx for the blind.  The last qquestion
on the survey askes if you would preview spoken interface.  No mention is
made anywhere of the status of the spoken interface except that it is in the
early stages of development and will appear in the next upgrade of osx.
Right now, it only works with some internal stuff for the mac but this is
planned to be expandable with additions to the development kits for internal
and external use.  Don't expect to see a beta any time soon.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


No it hasn;t. Currently they are looking for beta testers I believe:
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/questionnaire.html

I'm not sure how many beta testers they think they will get, since I
don't imagine there are many visually impaired users that currently
have macs...

/bob

--- David Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.
>


__________________________________
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Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[hank smith]

where on earth can I get my hands on a mac fore really really cheap?
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Poehlman" <poehlman1@comcast.net>
To: <bob.dodd@acm.org>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 8:04 AM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> There are quite a few potential beta candidates out there.  I am one of
them
> who has a titanium g4 powerbook running osx but the only way I can
currently
> use it is with os9 and outspoken for the mac.  There are lots of people
for
> one reason or another who are currently not working in some places because
> there is no screen reading access to osx for the blind.  The last
qquestion
> on the survey askes if you would preview spoken interface.  No mention is
> made anywhere of the status of the spoken interface except that it is in
the
> early stages of development and will appear in the next upgrade of osx.
> Right now, it only works with some internal stuff for the mac but this is
> planned to be expandable with additions to the development kits for
internal
> and external use.  Don't expect to see a beta any time soon.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 10:25 AM
> Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>
>
> No it hasn;t. Currently they are looking for beta testers I believe:
> http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/questionnaire.html
>
> I'm not sure how many beta testers they think they will get, since I
> don't imagine there are many visually impaired users that currently
> have macs...
>
> /bob
>
> --- David Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> > From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[monte single]

And how much mac does it take to run this software?

hank smith wrote:

> where on earth can I get my hands on a mac fore really really cheap?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David Poehlman" <poehlman1@comcast.net>
> To: <bob.dodd@acm.org>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 8:04 AM
> Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>
> > There are quite a few potential beta candidates out there.  I am one of
> them
> > who has a titanium g4 powerbook running osx but the only way I can
> currently
> > use it is with os9 and outspoken for the mac.  There are lots of people
> for
> > one reason or another who are currently not working in some places because
> > there is no screen reading access to osx for the blind.  The last
> qquestion
> > on the survey askes if you would preview spoken interface.  No mention is
> > made anywhere of the status of the spoken interface except that it is in
> the
> > early stages of development and will appear in the next upgrade of osx.
> > Right now, it only works with some internal stuff for the mac but this is
> > planned to be expandable with additions to the development kits for
> internal
> > and external use.  Don't expect to see a beta any time soon.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 10:25 AM
> > Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
> >
> >
> > No it hasn;t. Currently they are looking for beta testers I believe:
> > http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/questionnaire.html
> >
> > I'm not sure how many beta testers they think they will get, since I
> > don't imagine there are many visually impaired users that currently
> > have macs...
> >
> > /bob
> >
> > --- David Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.
> > >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Sean McMahon]

You all might want to look at the emacspeak archives for ways to run emacspeak
under osx.
Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Poehlman" <poehlman1@comcast.net>
To: <bob.dodd@acm.org>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> There are quite a few potential beta candidates out there.  I am one of them
> who has a titanium g4 powerbook running osx but the only way I can currently
> use it is with os9 and outspoken for the mac.  There are lots of people for
> one reason or another who are currently not working in some places because
> there is no screen reading access to osx for the blind.  The last qquestion
> on the survey askes if you would preview spoken interface.  No mention is
> made anywhere of the status of the spoken interface except that it is in the
> early stages of development and will appear in the next upgrade of osx.
> Right now, it only works with some internal stuff for the mac but this is
> planned to be expandable with additions to the development kits for internal
> and external use.  Don't expect to see a beta any time soon.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 10:25 AM
> Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>
>
> No it hasn;t. Currently they are looking for beta testers I believe:
> http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/questionnaire.html
>
> I'm not sure how many beta testers they think they will get, since I
> don't imagine there are many visually impaired users that currently
> have macs...
>
> /bob
>
> --- David Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> > From what I have gathered, it has not yet been launched.
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Darrell Shandrow]

Hi Bob,

There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent access to
console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle any
graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the Apple OS X
GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a window
to the shell available in OS X...

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 3:45 AM
Subject: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> Apple have just launched a spoken interface for Mac OS X. It seems very
> "Speakup" in its approach (maybe not so surprosing when you think what
> OS X is derived from). It would be great to do a comparision of the two
> platforms, partly to see what they've missed, and partly to see what
> Speakup can learn from it. Anyone have a Mac capable of running OS X?
>
> The link to Apple's annonucement is:
> http://www.apple.com/accessibility/spokeninterface/
>
> /bob dodd
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Bob Dodd]

Hi Darrell,

Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
installation.

I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
with that...

It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
something of use.

/bob dodd

--- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> Hi Bob,
> 
> There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> access to
> console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> any
> graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> Apple OS X
> GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> window
> to the shell available in OS X...


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Darrell Shandrow]

Hi Bob,

I think the Mac with Spoken Interface will be as usable or not to the
totally blind as is Windows or Linux; it'll all depend on the capabilities
of the screen reader.  I'm not as concerned about the ability of the
partially sighted to gain access to anything, including technology, as I am
the totally blind.  They remain able to operate in the sighted world, and,
all they really need is some sort of magnification, which is always easier
to implement than is real accessibility for blind users.

Darrell Shandrow - Shandrow Communications!
Technology consultant/instructor, network/systems administrator!
A+, CCNA, Network+!
Check out high quality telecommunications services at http://ld.net/?nu7i
All the best to coalition forces carrying out Operation Iraqi Freedom!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 4:08 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> Hi Darrell,
>
> Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
> I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
> SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
> installation.
>
> I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
> Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
> source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
> competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
> should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
> because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
> users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
> with that...
>
> It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
> seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
> to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
> look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
> something of use.
>
> /bob dodd
>
> --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> > Hi Bob,
> >
> > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> > access to
> > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> > any
> > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> > Apple OS X
> > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> > window
> > to the shell available in OS X...
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[David Poehlman]

I wouldn't make lite of this, Those who need visual assistive technology 
have problems with the gui that are akin to what we face.  Ask any zoom text 
user who has gone thorugh the itterations of version 8.0 to tell you why 
there have been so many.  Ask any magic or zoom text user to tell you about 
panning.  Ask them about their web experiences.  There is much much more to 
this than meets the eye/ear unless I am missing something.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Darrell Shandrow" <nu7i@azboss.net>
To: <bob.dodd@acm.org>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 11:25 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


Hi Bob,

I think the Mac with Spoken Interface will be as usable or not to the
totally blind as is Windows or Linux; it'll all depend on the capabilities
of the screen reader.  I'm not as concerned about the ability of the
partially sighted to gain access to anything, including technology, as I am
the totally blind.  They remain able to operate in the sighted world, and,
all they really need is some sort of magnification, which is always easier
to implement than is real accessibility for blind users.

Darrell Shandrow - Shandrow Communications!
Technology consultant/instructor, network/systems administrator!
A+, CCNA, Network+!
Check out high quality telecommunications services at http://ld.net/?nu7i
All the best to coalition forces carrying out Operation Iraqi Freedom!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 4:08 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> Hi Darrell,
>
> Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
> I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
> SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
> installation.
>
> I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
> Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
> source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
> competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
> should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
> because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
> users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
> with that...
>
> It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
> seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
> to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
> look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
> something of use.
>
> /bob dodd
>
> --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> > Hi Bob,
> >
> > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> > access to
> > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> > any
> > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> > Apple OS X
> > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> > window
> > to the shell available in OS X...
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Darrell Shandrow]

Hi David,

Yeah, perhaps you're right to an extent, but, nevertheless, they're
operating in a visual mode.  Other sighted people have a much better
understanding of their use of the computer than ours, so they're more likely
to receive the assistance and accomodations they require in school, at work
and elsewhere...  I've seen this sort of thing happen over and over again,
so that we totals get the shortest possible end of the stick...  So, I guess
I have little sympathy...


Darrell Shandrow - Shandrow Communications!
Technology consultant/instructor, network/systems administrator!
A+, CCNA, Network+!
Check out high quality telecommunications services at http://ld.net/?nu7i
All the best to coalition forces carrying out Operation Iraqi Freedom!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Poehlman" <poehlman1@comcast.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> I wouldn't make lite of this, Those who need visual assistive technology
> have problems with the gui that are akin to what we face.  Ask any zoom
text
> user who has gone thorugh the itterations of version 8.0 to tell you why
> there have been so many.  Ask any magic or zoom text user to tell you
about
> panning.  Ask them about their web experiences.  There is much much more
to
> this than meets the eye/ear unless I am missing something.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Darrell Shandrow" <nu7i@azboss.net>
> To: <bob.dodd@acm.org>; "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 11:25 PM
> Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> I think the Mac with Spoken Interface will be as usable or not to the
> totally blind as is Windows or Linux; it'll all depend on the capabilities
> of the screen reader.  I'm not as concerned about the ability of the
> partially sighted to gain access to anything, including technology, as I
am
> the totally blind.  They remain able to operate in the sighted world, and,
> all they really need is some sort of magnification, which is always easier
> to implement than is real accessibility for blind users.
>
> Darrell Shandrow - Shandrow Communications!
> Technology consultant/instructor, network/systems administrator!
> A+, CCNA, Network+!
> Check out high quality telecommunications services at http://ld.net/?nu7i
> All the best to coalition forces carrying out Operation Iraqi Freedom!
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 4:08 PM
> Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>
>
> > Hi Darrell,
> >
> > Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
> > I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
> > SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
> > installation.
> >
> > I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
> > Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
> > source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
> > competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
> > should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
> > because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
> > users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
> > with that...
> >
> > It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
> > seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
> > to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
> > look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
> > something of use.
> >
> > /bob dodd
> >
> > --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> > > Hi Bob,
> > >
> > > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> > > access to
> > > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> > > any
> > > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> > > Apple OS X
> > > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> > > window
> > > to the shell available in OS X...
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Bob Dodd]

Hi Darrell,

"we totals get the shortest possible end of the stick". I'm really
sorry that you feel like that, you must have had some rotten
experiences.

I come at tools such as Speakup from a different angle. I'm a (sighted)
researcher at the Uniersity of Teesside, doing a PhD in the mobile
device accessibility (phones, PDAs, E-Books, MP3 players, that sort of
thing). I sotrt of got into accessibility through family experiences:
my dad lost his ability to speak through a faulty medical procedure,
and my cousin Paul has multiple sclerosis, my cousin Christine has
cognitive problems caused by severe epilepsy, and my niece has
dyscalculia. It's my cousin Paul that's most relevant here.

Multiple Sclerosis (MS) is a degenerative disease of the central
nervous system (CNS), and it's a weird, weird disease. It can affect
any part of the CNS, but not consistently. Literally, at least in the
early stages of the disease, you can go running in the morning, and not
be able to stand in the afternoon. There are lots of symptoms, the ones
Paul, who is in the progressive phase of the disease, has include
having no sense of touch, vertigo, blurred/double vision, severe muscle
spasms, and a lack of fine motor control (so he has difficulty pressing
keys on the keyboard even if he can see them). His vision problmes are
why I'm looking at Speakup.

For Paul, he needs text-to-speech (TTS) because even though he can see
after a fashion, and if you don't mind two of everything dancing in
front of you, he can't look at the scren for very long without his
vision getting progressively worse. And concentrating on the screen
tends to set off his vertigo and spasms. He can look long enough (with
big text or a magnifier application) to start an application, but he
can't sit in front of the PC for more than five minutes doing any work.
Tools like Speakup help him confirm what he's seeing, and allow him to
read e-books without having to stare at the screen. TTS also manages to
lengthen the time he can spend at his PC before his symptoms take over.
Tools like Speakup and Jaws (not my favourite tool I have to say) allow
 Paul to have a private life and live at home, paying his own bills,
shopping, sending emails to his girlfriend etc. As his condition
worstens, it will become increasing the only way he can have any
quality of life at all.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that TTS for people who are totally
blind is very important, but you don't have to be totally blind to have
to rely on TTS. I hope learning about MS will improve your tolerance
level a little.

/bob


--- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> Hi David,
> 
> Yeah, perhaps you're right to an extent, but, nevertheless, they're
> operating in a visual mode.  Other sighted people have a much better
> understanding of their use of the computer than ours, so they're more
> likely
> to receive the assistance and accomodations they require in school,
> at work
> and elsewhere...  I've seen this sort of thing happen over and over
> again,
> so that we totals get the shortest possible end of the stick...  So,
> I guess
> I have little sympathy...
> 


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Sean Murphy]

Hi All.

As the saying goes, don't count your chickens until they all have hatch.  I
be very surprised if version 1 of the product works with many commercial
applications other than the OS itself.  Think about the number of years that
the windows screen readers have taken to get to their current point.  There
is a lot of issues that has to be taken into concideration when designing a
screen reader.  How flexiable will the product be, will it be like Microsoft
Narritor or the old Berkly Outspoken.

Time will see.

Also, the market share that Apple has is very small and it will be
interesting how much of an impack it will have to the mark for disabilities.

Sean

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Janina Sajka]

Well, Apple is fairly confident that many applications will talk out of the box. As I recall the demo I had, they're saying something along the lines of 90% of the apps written with their new developer tools where accessibility support has been included since the tools where released two years ago. We'll see, of course, when we get a closer look.

Also, I suspect that "screen reader" may not be the right term. In fact, Apple isn't using this term, and I think they're correct. There's no "reading of the screen" going on. Rather the objects which make up the application all have accessible properties which are queried to support the spoken interface. So, while there's an on screen interface, the spoken interface is actually a synchronized parallel interface.

At least, this is how I understand what I heard during my half hour or so with Apple last Thursday.

Sean Murphy writes:
> Hi All.
> 
> As the saying goes, don't count your chickens until they all have hatch.  I
> be very surprised if version 1 of the product works with many commercial
> applications other than the OS itself.  Think about the number of years that
> the windows screen readers have taken to get to their current point.  There
> is a lot of issues that has to be taken into concideration when designing a
> screen reader.  How flexiable will the product be, will it be like Microsoft
> Narritor or the old Berkly Outspoken.
> 
> Time will see.
> 
> Also, the market share that Apple has is very small and it will be
> interesting how much of an impack it will have to the mark for disabilities.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Director
				Technology Research and Development
				Governmental Relations Group
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

Email: janina@afb.net		Phone: (202) 408-8175

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[David Poehlman]

I think we have heard similar claims in the past by others which turned out 
to be a bit shy of the truth.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


Well, Apple is fairly confident that many applications will talk out of the 
box. As I recall the demo I had, they're saying something along the lines of 
90% of the apps written with their new developer tools where accessibility 
support has been included since the tools where released two years ago. 
We'll see, of course, when we get a closer look.

Also, I suspect that "screen reader" may not be the right term. In fact, 
Apple isn't using this term, and I think they're correct. There's no 
"reading of the screen" going on. Rather the objects which make up the 
application all have accessible properties which are queried to support the 
spoken interface. So, while there's an on screen interface, the spoken 
interface is actually a synchronized parallel interface.

At least, this is how I understand what I heard during my half hour or so 
with Apple last Thursday.

Sean Murphy writes:
> Hi All.
>
> As the saying goes, don't count your chickens until they all have hatch. 
> I
> be very surprised if version 1 of the product works with many commercial
> applications other than the OS itself.  Think about the number of years 
> that
> the windows screen readers have taken to get to their current point. 
> There
> is a lot of issues that has to be taken into concideration when designing 
> a
> screen reader.  How flexiable will the product be, will it be like 
> Microsoft
> Narritor or the old Berkly Outspoken.
>
> Time will see.
>
> Also, the market share that Apple has is very small and it will be
> interesting how much of an impack it will have to the mark for 
> disabilities.
>
> Sean
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 

Janina Sajka, Director
Technology Research and Development
Governmental Relations Group
American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175

_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

RE: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Saqib Shaikh]

Yes, very true Janina.  As a developer I've spent quite a bit of time
looking at their accessibility support which is very similar to MSAA, except
that it goes further.  I also *think* it is similar to the Gnome
accessibility, but haven't had much experience of the latter .

All software written since OS x 10.2 was released will be accessible, and
this may well include many shareware apps that can be downloaded from the
internet, but will definitely not include any Microsoft products, including
Office X, Internet Explorer or MSN Messenger.  Office is the only one I'd
want to use anyway.  Also apps like Norton Antivirus/Systemworks may not
initially be accessible.  This is all because they existed under OS9, and
the developers have just ported them to OS x using Carbon, which doesn't get
accessibility by default (only Cocoa apps do).  But, with the 508
legislation etc this could change.

But I don't want this to negate the great stuff that Apple is doing - I
believe that all Apple software, such as the Ilife suite, is written in an
accessible way (or will be modified to be cccessible very soon).

Saqib

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca [mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
On Behalf Of Janina Sajka
Sent: 22 March 2004 00:17
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

Well, Apple is fairly confident that many applications will talk out of the
box. As I recall the demo I had, they're saying something along the lines of
90% of the apps written with their new developer tools where accessibility
support has been included since the tools where released two years ago.
We'll see, of course, when we get a closer look.

Also, I suspect that "screen reader" may not be the right term. In fact,
Apple isn't using this term, and I think they're correct. There's no
"reading of the screen" going on. Rather the objects which make up the
application all have accessible properties which are queried to support the
spoken interface. So, while there's an on screen interface, the spoken
interface is actually a synchronized parallel interface.

At least, this is how I understand what I heard during my half hour or so
with Apple last Thursday.

Sean Murphy writes:
> Hi All.
> 
> As the saying goes, don't count your chickens until they all have 
> hatch.  I be very surprised if version 1 of the product works with 
> many commercial applications other than the OS itself.  Think about 
> the number of years that the windows screen readers have taken to get 
> to their current point.  There is a lot of issues that has to be taken 
> into concideration when designing a screen reader.  How flexiable will 
> the product be, will it be like Microsoft Narritor or the old Berkly
Outspoken.
> 
> Time will see.
> 
> Also, the market share that Apple has is very small and it will be 
> interesting how much of an impack it will have to the mark for
disabilities.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Director
				Technology Research and Development
				Governmental Relations Group
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

Email: janina@afb.net		Phone: (202) 408-8175

_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Janina Sajka]

You are also correct. To my mind there's no question but that 508 is responsible for Apple's efforts. They want to sell to the U.S. Government--a $40 Billion customer, and they know they need to be accessible to do so.

Saqib Shaikh writes:
> Yes, very true Janina.  As a developer I've spent quite a bit of time
> looking at their accessibility support which is very similar to MSAA, except
> that it goes further.  I also *think* it is similar to the Gnome
> accessibility, but haven't had much experience of the latter .
> 
> All software written since OS x 10.2 was released will be accessible, and
> this may well include many shareware apps that can be downloaded from the
> internet, but will definitely not include any Microsoft products, including
> Office X, Internet Explorer or MSN Messenger.  Office is the only one I'd
> want to use anyway.  Also apps like Norton Antivirus/Systemworks may not
> initially be accessible.  This is all because they existed under OS9, and
> the developers have just ported them to OS x using Carbon, which doesn't get
> accessibility by default (only Cocoa apps do).  But, with the 508
> legislation etc this could change.
> 
> But I don't want this to negate the great stuff that Apple is doing - I
> believe that all Apple software, such as the Ilife suite, is written in an
> accessible way (or will be modified to be cccessible very soon).
> 
> Saqib> 

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Sean Murphy]

Hi Janina

It will be interesting in the final outcome.  The approach that you have
mention below is simular to MSAA.  Therefore, this would mean that
applications would be restricted to the Development environments that uses
the Apple accessible modules and developers would have to ensure that they
set the correct properties to make the product work.  I do see problems with
this approach and major bonous's.

Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:16 AM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> Well, Apple is fairly confident that many applications will talk out of
the box. As I recall the demo I had, they're saying something along the
lines of 90% of the apps written with their new developer tools where
accessibility support has been included since the tools where released two
years ago. We'll see, of course, when we get a closer look.
>
> Also, I suspect that "screen reader" may not be the right term. In fact,
Apple isn't using this term, and I think they're correct. There's no
"reading of the screen" going on. Rather the objects which make up the
application all have accessible properties which are queried to support the
spoken interface. So, while there's an on screen interface, the spoken
interface is actually a synchronized parallel interface.
>
> At least, this is how I understand what I heard during my half hour or so
with Apple last Thursday.
>
> Sean Murphy writes:
> > Hi All.
> >
> > As the saying goes, don't count your chickens until they all have hatch.
I
> > be very surprised if version 1 of the product works with many commercial
> > applications other than the OS itself.  Think about the number of years
that
> > the windows screen readers have taken to get to their current point.
There
> > is a lot of issues that has to be taken into concideration when
designing a
> > screen reader.  How flexiable will the product be, will it be like
Microsoft
> > Narritor or the old Berkly Outspoken.
> >
> > Time will see.
> >
> > Also, the market share that Apple has is very small and it will be
> > interesting how much of an impack it will have to the mark for
disabilities.
> >
> > Sean
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> -- 
>
> Janina Sajka, Director
> Technology Research and Development
> Governmental Relations Group
> American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
>
> Email: janina@afb.net Phone: (202) 408-8175
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Janina Sajka]

My conversations with the Apple developers suggest that the Mac terminal is supported. I did not discuss installation, but I wouldn't expect it's covered. I could be wrong, of course.

Bob Dodd writes:
> Hi Darrell,
> 
> Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
> I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
> SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
> installation.
> 
> I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
> Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
> source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
> competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
> should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
> because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
> users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
> with that...
> 
> It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
> seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
> to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
> look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
> something of use.
> 
> /bob dodd
> 
> --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> > Hi Bob,
> > 
> > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> > access to
> > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> > any
> > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> > Apple OS X
> > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> > window
> > to the shell available in OS X...
> 
> 
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Director
				Technology Research and Development
				Governmental Relations Group
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

Email: janina@afb.net		Phone: (202) 408-8175

Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Sean McMahon]

Really I thought the whole point of osx was to make it like linux.  I hated the
old macs because you didn't have keyboard commands to do simple things like
opening files.  Aren't Macs still way more expensive then win or linux pc boxes?
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob Dodd" <Bob.Dodd@rocketmail.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 4:08 PM
Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X


> Hi Darrell,
>
> Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
> I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
> SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
> installation.
>
> I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
> Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
> source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
> competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
> should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
> because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
> users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
> with that...
>
> It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
> seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
> to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
> look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
> something of use.
>
> /bob dodd
>
> --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
> > Hi Bob,
> >
> > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
> > access to
> > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
> > any
> > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
> > Apple OS X
> > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
> > window
> > to the shell available in OS X...
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

While the Blazer will read the entire screen to you, you will want a hard
copy of what you are looking at to remember all the menus or to look at the
options.
In my bios the command was the print key next to the scroll lock key which
sent all the screen data to the blazer.
You don't need a conversion cable as the Blazer has both parallel and serial
ports.  The parallel  port is for use with pc's, and serial port is for use
with notetakers such as the BNS.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Although wouldn't you have to have some osrt of parallel to serial
> adapter plugged into the parallel port of the Blazer, since the print
> screen command won't send output to the serial port?
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 10:38:22PM -0600, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> > Since the blazer can also speak whatever comes in through its parallel
> > port, you theoretically wouldn't need lots of paper.
> >
> > I'll have to try this some time to see if it works. I assume the
> > print screen key on the keyboard is used to issue the print screen
> > command?
> >
> > Greg
> >
> > P.S. My machines here all have Award BIOSes, anyone know if this works
> > for a fact with Award BIOSes?
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does
work in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help
to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFAU+tQNohoaf1zXJMRAq+sAKCEHnk2CaI8TyNnCkOh3IJVlP2grgCeL9CA
> CGrHf7Vkfv1BesmC2rLaMG8=
> =zEBw
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Igor Gueths]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

One problem though. How do you translate the output, or does the blazer 
do this natively? 
On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 01:11:51PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> While the Blazer will read the entire screen to you, you will want a hard
> copy of what you are looking at to remember all the menus or to look at the
> options.
> In my bios the command was the print key next to the scroll lock key which
> sent all the screen data to the blazer.
> You don't need a conversion cable as the Blazer has both parallel and serial
> ports.  The parallel  port is for use with pc's, and serial port is for use
> with notetakers such as the BNS.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 12:19 AM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Although wouldn't you have to have some osrt of parallel to serial
> > adapter plugged into the parallel port of the Blazer, since the print
> > screen command won't send output to the serial port?
> > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 10:38:22PM -0600, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> > > Since the blazer can also speak whatever comes in through its parallel
> > > port, you theoretically wouldn't need lots of paper.
> > >
> > > I'll have to try this some time to see if it works. I assume the
> > > print screen key on the keyboard is used to issue the print screen
> > > command?
> > >
> > > Greg
> > >
> > > P.S. My machines here all have Award BIOSes, anyone know if this works
> > > for a fact with Award BIOSes?
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does
> work in
> > > > alot of cases.
> > > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help
> to
> > > > depend on.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
> >
> > iD8DBQFAU+tQNohoaf1zXJMRAq+sAKCEHnk2CaI8TyNnCkOh3IJVlP2grgCeL9CA
> > CGrHf7Vkfv1BesmC2rLaMG8=
> > =zEBw
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)

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OV6Hse2CZDDNkovMeMLYTsE=
=tAZ0
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

Yes, the blazer will do this natively, think of it as being just like
7using the serial port, except that you're using the parallel port.

Greg


On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 02:54:54PM -0500, Igor Gueths wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> One problem though. How do you translate the output, or does the blazer 
> do this natively? 

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean Murphy]

Hi Greg.

This sounds fine with older bios.  But newer BIOS's uses a more graphical
interface.  Where you have everything on the screen at one.  How do you know
where you are?  The Weasel card sound very interesting in deed.

Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 6:58 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Yes, the blazer will do this natively, think of it as being just like
> 7using the serial port, except that you're using the parallel port.
>
> Greg
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 02:54:54PM -0500, Igor Gueths wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > One problem though. How do you translate the output, or does the blazer
> > do this natively?
>
> -- 
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

Yes, the Weasel card sounds very interesting, but looking at the web
site posted here earlier, it also looks very expensive.

Greg


On Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 10:42:34AM +1100, Sean Murphy wrote:
> Hi Greg.
> 
> This sounds fine with older bios.  But newer BIOS's uses a more graphical
> interface.  Where you have everything on the screen at one.  How do you know
> where you are?  The Weasel card sound very interesting in deed.
> 
> Sean

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Tom and Esther Ward]

Hi. There is no translation on the braille print out of the bios. Everything
comes out in grade 1 braille with no contractions etc...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> One problem though. How do you translate the output, or does the blazer
> do this natively?
> On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 01:11:51PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > While the Blazer will read the entire screen to you, you will want a
hard
> > copy of what you are looking at to remember all the menus or to look at
the
> > options.
> > In my bios the command was the print key next to the scroll lock key
which
> > sent all the screen data to the blazer.
> > You don't need a conversion cable as the Blazer has both parallel and
serial
> > ports.  The parallel  port is for use with pc's, and serial port is for
use
> > with notetakers such as the BNS.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Igor Gueths" <igueths@lava-net.com>
> > To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 12:19 AM
> > Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > > Hash: SHA1
> > >
> > > Although wouldn't you have to have some osrt of parallel to serial
> > > adapter plugged into the parallel port of the Blazer, since the print
> > > screen command won't send output to the serial port?
> > > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 10:38:22PM -0600, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> > > > Since the blazer can also speak whatever comes in through its
parallel
> > > > port, you theoretically wouldn't need lots of paper.
> > > >
> > > > I'll have to try this some time to see if it works. I assume the
> > > > print screen key on the keyboard is used to issue the print screen
> > > > command?
> > > >
> > > > Greg
> > > >
> > > > P.S. My machines here all have Award BIOSes, anyone know if this
works
> > > > for a fact with Award BIOSes?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> > > > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer
such
> > as a
> > > > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to
print
> > the
> > > > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus
and to
> > see
> > > > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method
does
> > work in
> > > > > alot of cases.
> > > > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted
help
> > to
> > > > > depend on.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Speakup mailing list
> > > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
> > >
> > > iD8DBQFAU+tQNohoaf1zXJMRAq+sAKCEHnk2CaI8TyNnCkOh3IJVlP2grgCeL9CA
> > > CGrHf7Vkfv1BesmC2rLaMG8=
> > > =zEBw
> > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFAVLiONohoaf1zXJMRAh5YAKCr2cNr1Yy/2/P2/gAriMtIFDtQiwCfScmZ
> OV6Hse2CZDDNkovMeMLYTsE=
> =tAZ0
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Ryan Mann]

Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
pronounce words correctly.

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:

> Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> the options and what they are set to.
> It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> alot of cases.
> If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> depend on.
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> Hi Folks,
> How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> Cheers,
> Cris
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[hank smith]

clever idea
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> pronounce words correctly.
>
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
>
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean Murphy]

Hi.

If it could be done, it would extremely exspensive.  Since there would be a
very small market that would wnat it.

Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "hank smith" <hank@hanksmith.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 4:04 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> clever idea
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 8:43 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> > Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> > computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> > the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> > It seems like it would be possible to create another device that
connects
> > to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> > speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> > would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> > pronounce words correctly.
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> >
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does
work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help
to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Joseph C. Lininger]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I'm sure it's been thought of. Problem is, the device would be so
expensive and would be so limited in what it could read that the cost
wouldn't be worth it. They'd never sell.
- ---
Joseph C. Lininger
jbahm@pcdesk.net
- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would
> see on the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets
> information. It seems like it would be possible to create another
> device that connects to the AGP port and gets the same information,
> except this device would speak the information instead of showing
> it on the screen.  The device would probably need to be a computer
> itself so it can be programmed to pronounce words correctly.
> 
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> 
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer
> > such as a braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen
> > command to print the entire screen to a braille page and follow
> > it through the menus and to see the options and what they are set
> > to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method
> > does work in alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted
> > help to depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without
> > sighted assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed
> > zillions of times before, but are we close to a time when this
> > will be possible? Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I had thought about creating one of those. that'd be really cool to 
have.
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:43:53PM -0500, Ryan Mann wrote:
> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> pronounce words correctly.
> 
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> 
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Glenn Ervin at Home]

Maybe it's a matter of having a speech device that plugs into an existing
video card in either an AGP port, or PCI or EISA.
Some video cards come with places to plug in more memory, but I don't know
if this kind of access would work for such a speech chip.
Glenn.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alex Snow" <alex_snow@gmx.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 9:43 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I had thought about creating one of those. that'd be really cool to
have.
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:43:53PM -0500, Ryan Mann wrote:
> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> pronounce words correctly.
>
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
>
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

speaking of video cards why do all video cards (or at least all the 
ones I have here) have a 25-pin connecter on the card like where you'd 
plug in a dongle or something?
On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 10:12:07AM -0600, 
Glenn Ervin at Home wrote:
> Maybe it's a matter of having a speech device that plugs into an existing
> video card in either an AGP port, or PCI or EISA.
> Some video cards come with places to plug in more memory, but I don't know
> if this kind of access would work for such a speech chip.
> Glenn.
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Alex Snow" <alex_snow@gmx.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 9:43 AM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I had thought about creating one of those. that'd be really cool to
> have.
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:43:53PM -0500, Ryan Mann wrote:
> > Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> > computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> > the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> > It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> > to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> > speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> > would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> > pronounce words correctly.
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> >
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> - -- 
> Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
> back.
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
> 
> iD8DBQFAVH259XVrM3ri110RAhYRAJ9vAPm+3IQ7UUvyn+XopScA27aAoACghaQJ
> WujjHYLTKcTgCtye2dxDdl8=
> =+Ovf
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

Yeah, so have I. The problem is I wasn't sure how I'd get
started. It's one thing to capture the video output, but something
else to actually turn it into tts.

Greg

On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 10:43:54AM -0500, Alex Snow wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I had thought about creating one of those. that'd be really cool to 
> have.

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean McMahon]

Has anyone thought of a device that was like an eye that could just see screens
and speak what was on them.  Something you could put up to any screen anywhere.
Just an idea of mine that I don't have the knowledge time for.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> pronounce words correctly.
>
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
>
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

RE: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Saqib Shaikh]

What you've described is the Optacon - no longer made, but several projects
are under way to make a replacement.

Saqib
 

-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca [mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
On Behalf Of Sean McMahon
Sent: 15 March 2004 17:08
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

Has anyone thought of a device that was like an eye that could just see
screens and speak what was on them.  Something you could put up to any
screen anywhere.
Just an idea of mine that I don't have the knowledge time for.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> pronounce words correctly.
>
> On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
>
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work
in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[hank smith]

what other projects?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Saqib Shaikh" <S.Shaikh@sussex.ac.uk>
To: "'Sean McMahon'" <smcmahon@usgs.gov>; "'Speakup is a screen review
system for Linux.'" <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 9:16 AM
Subject: RE: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> What you've described is the Optacon - no longer made, but several
projects
> are under way to make a replacement.
>
> Saqib
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
> On Behalf Of Sean McMahon
> Sent: 15 March 2004 17:08
> To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
> Has anyone thought of a device that was like an eye that could just see
> screens and speak what was on them.  Something you could put up to any
> screen anywhere.
> Just an idea of mine that I don't have the knowledge time for.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> > Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> > computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> > the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> > It seems like it would be possible to create another device that
connects
> > to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> > speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> > would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> > pronounce words correctly.
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> >
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does
work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help
to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

RE: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Saqib Shaikh]

Hi

I don't have much detail, but one alternative is VideoTim
(http://www.abtim.de/).  Another is made in Russia I think and is basically
a digital Camera mounted on a handheld computer so you point this camera at
something and it OCR's the text, and reads it aloud.  The claim was that you
could point this at a road sign or notice board and read stuff - but I am
not sure if it is for sale yet.

Saqib


-----Original Message-----
From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca [mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
On Behalf Of hank smith
Sent: 15 March 2004 17:29
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

what other projects?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Saqib Shaikh" <S.Shaikh@sussex.ac.uk>
To: "'Sean McMahon'" <smcmahon@usgs.gov>; "'Speakup is a screen review
system for Linux.'" <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 9:16 AM
Subject: RE: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> What you've described is the Optacon - no longer made, but several
projects
> are under way to make a replacement.
>
> Saqib
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca
[mailto:speakup-bounces@braille.uwo.ca]
> On Behalf Of Sean McMahon
> Sent: 15 March 2004 17:08
> To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux.
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
> Has anyone thought of a device that was like an eye that could just 
> see screens and speak what was on them.  Something you could put up to 
> any screen anywhere.
> Just an idea of mine that I don't have the knowledge time for.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> > Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a 
> > computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would 
> > see on the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets
information.
> > It seems like it would be possible to create another device that
connects
> > to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device 
> > would speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  
> > The device would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be 
> > programmed to pronounce words correctly.
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> >
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer 
> > > such
> as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to 
> > > print
> the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus 
> > > and to
> see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method 
> > > does
work
> in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted 
> > > help
to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without 
> > > sighted assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed 
> > > zillions of times before, but are we close to a time when this will be
possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Buddy Brannan]

Another project is the P2RD:
http://www.catechnology.net
-- 
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV
------------------------------------------------------------
Children can come from the heart, too. Please help us bring the child 
of our heart into our home! Visit http://ouradoption.brannan.name or 
Email ouradoption@brannan.name to find out how you can help us. 
Thanks!

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I've heard that an opticon is good for doing stuff like this if you 
know what print letters are shaped like.
On Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 
10:07:54AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> Has anyone thought of a device that was like an eye that could just see screens
> and speak what was on them.  Something you could put up to any screen anywhere.
> Just an idea of mine that I don't have the knowledge time for.
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ryan Mann" <rmann@rmisp.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Cc: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:43 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> > Has anybody thought of creating a device that would hook up to a
> > computer's monitor port and speak whatever a sighted person would see on
> > the screen?  A monitor connects to an AGP port and gets information.
> > It seems like it would be possible to create another device that connects
> > to the AGP port and gets the same information, except this device would
> > speak the information instead of showing it on the screen.  The device
> > would probably need to be a computer itself so it can be programmed to
> > pronounce words correctly.
> >
> > On Sat, 13 Mar 2004, Tom and Esther Ward wrote:
> >
> > > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > > the options and what they are set to.
> > > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > > alot of cases.
> > > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > > depend on.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > > Cheers,
> > > Cris
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I've also heard of people getting this working with a bns/blt using 
the printscreen key.
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and 
Esther Ward wrote:
> Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> the options and what they are set to.
> It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> alot of cases.
> If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> depend on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> Hi Folks,
> How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> Cheers,
> Cris
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

I see how that could work with a blt, assuming that its parallel port
is a bidirectional port. However, I don't see how it would work with a
bns, unless the bios can send the output via a serial port. You
wouldn't be able to use the serial to parallel converter, since that
only works one way to provide output, and can't deal with input.

Greg


On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 10:42:09AM -0500, Alex Snow wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I've also heard of people getting this working with a bns/blt using 
> the printscreen key.

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean McMahon]

You can set the blt to full-duplex, they call it, is that the same as
bi-directional?  I don't know about not being able to send out via cerial.  Mine
seems to make sounds and say weird jiberish when the computer starts that is
when I turn it on and after the first beep.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> I see how that could work with a blt, assuming that its parallel port
> is a bidirectional port. However, I don't see how it would work with a
> bns, unless the bios can send the output via a serial port. You
> wouldn't be able to use the serial to parallel converter, since that
> only works one way to provide output, and can't deal with input.
>
> Greg
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 10:42:09AM -0500, Alex Snow wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > I've also heard of people getting this working with a bns/blt using
> > the printscreen key.
>
> -- 
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Gregory Nowak]

No, full duplex and bidirectional communication are not one and the
same.

Greg


On Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 10:22:35AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> You can set the blt to full-duplex, they call it, is that the same as
> bi-directional?  I don't know about not being able to send out via cerial.  Mine
> seems to make sounds and say weird jiberish when the computer starts that is
> when I turn it on and after the first beep.
> 

-- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean McMahon]

That's great!  did they have to use the paralel or cerial port?
Sean
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alex Snow" <alex_snow@gmx.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 8:42 AM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I've also heard of people getting this working with a bns/blt using 
> the printscreen key.
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 11:18:19PM -0500, Tom and 
> Esther Ward wrote:
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> > 
> > 
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> - -- 
> Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
> back.
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)
> 
> iD8DBQFAVH1Q9XVrM3ri110RAhdYAJ9vAIlpxf2yho/C+150pfXRjowhiQCfdCCd
> xUcw5vVtvqz+xaiZEzBLMIM=
> =Zys0
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

speakup documentation

[Roy Nickelson]

hi,
where is the speakup documentation stored?  acutally I can't find the
speakup directory at all.
Roy

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Sean McMahon]

Braille printer eye?  I no what my next necessary work purchase will be.  Look
back a few months in the archives and you will find several messages to talking
bios.  Janina for example, is fortunate enough to have analpha with a bios that
talks.  If the origonal poster has one of those you're in luck.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom and Esther Ward" <tward1978@earthlink.net>
To: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>; "Speakup is a screen review system for
Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:18 PM
Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?


> Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> the options and what they are set to.
> It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> alot of cases.
> If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> depend on.
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
>
>
> Hi Folks,
> How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> Cheers,
> Cris
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?

[Alex Snow]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

the alphas are cool macihes. I'm currently trying to aquire one.
On Mon, 
Mar 15, 2004 at 10:04:24AM -0700, Sean McMahon wrote:
> Braille printer eye?  I no what my next necessary work purchase will be.  Look
> back a few months in the archives and you will find several messages to talking
> bios.  Janina for example, is fortunate enough to have analpha with a bios that
> talks.  If the origonal poster has one of those you're in luck.
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Tom and Esther Ward" <tward1978@earthlink.net>
> To: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>; "Speakup is a screen review system for
> Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:18 PM
> Subject: Re: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> 
> 
> > Hi, to access the bios the most helpful tool is a braille printer such as a
> > braille blazer.  You can sometimes use a print screen command to print the
> > entire screen to a braille page and follow it through the menus and to see
> > the options and what they are set to.
> > It takes alot of time and paper to do it right, but the method does work in
> > alot of cases.
> > If you don't have a braille printer then all you have is sighted help to
> > depend on.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cris" <filastin48@hotmail.com>
> > To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 2:52 PM
> > Subject: changing bios settings, without eyes, how?
> >
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> > How can a blind person change the settings of the bios without sighted
> > assistance?  I know that this subject was discussed zillions of times
> > before, but are we close to a time when this will be possible?
> > Cheers,
> > Cris
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

- -- 
Always borrow money from a pessimist; he doesn't expect to be paid
back.

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Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X

[Marshall F. Scott]

Hello all,
I saw an FAQ that specifically stated that the current installation
procedure requires sighted assistance.
Marshall


----------
>From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
>To: bob.dodd@acm.org, "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
<speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>Subject: Re: Spoken interface for Mac OS X
>Date: Sun, Mar 21, 2004, 8:11 AM
>

> My conversations with the Apple developers suggest that the Mac terminal is
> supported. I did not discuss installation, but I wouldn't expect it's
> covered. I could be wrong, of course.
>
> Bob Dodd writes:
>> Hi Darrell,
>>
>> Yes, I wondered how well it would handle shell windows myself, it's why
>> I was look for anyone who might be thinking of trying out
>> SpokenInterface. I was also interested in how well it handled
>> installation.
>>
>> I also think you're right: SpokenInterface isn't competition for
>> Speakup, it's a different market and a different philosophy (open
>> source as opposed to closed source). I reckon SpokenInterface is more
>> competition for windows based tools like Jaws: The cost of a mac+OSX
>> should give PC+windows+Jaws a real run for its money. I also suspect,
>> because the mac is so GUI driven, it will appeal more to low-vision
>> users, rather than to blind users, though I'm sure people will disagree
>> with that...
>>
>> It will be very interesting though, to see how well, and how
>> seamlessly, integrated Apple have managed to make SpokenInterface seem
>> to users, and what Speakup can learn from it. Apple are very good at
>> look & feel (and design in general) so my guess is we'll learn
>> something of use.
>>
>> /bob dodd
>>
>> --- Darrell Shandrow <nu7i@azboss.net> wrote:
>> > Hi Bob,
>> >
>> > There's really no comparison.  While Speakup provides excellent
>> > access to
>> > console-based applications and the Linux OS itself, it doesn't handle
>> > any
>> > graphical user interfaces.  Spoken Interface is designed for the
>> > Apple OS X
>> > GUI.  I wonder if it is even going to do anything if the user opens a
>> > window
>> > to the shell available in OS X...
>>
>>
>> __________________________________
>> Do you Yahoo!?
>> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
>> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> --
>  
>     Janina Sajka, Director
>     Technology Research and Development
>     Governmental Relations Group
>     American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)
>
> Email: janina@afb.net  Phone: (202) 408-8175
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup