slightly o-t, looking for os help

slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Littlefield, tyler]

Hello list,
I'm into building my own OS, just for fun, to see what breaks, and test my knowledge etc.
I've got two questions.
First, does someone have some code that I can use to write, or know of how to write the OS to the disk? I can make a normal boot loader, etc, but I'm not sure how to write this.
Last, is there a virtual machine that will simulate the os, so I dno't have to try to figure out how to build a reader into the os? I'm looking for something that is command-line driven if possible.
If not, just something that runs, and loads the OS, which will be command line driven, without all the nice window functions and etc, it could open in its own tty etc, just as long as it runs the os. <grins>
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
Unlimited horizons head coder.
check out our website:
tysplace.homelinux.net
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Doug Sutherland]

If you are building an os for fun, it might be good to use
an emulator rather than physical hardware. There are
many around for example bochs will emulate the x86
hardware, and there are others for ARM and countless
other architectures.

On x86 the BIOS will expect a bootloader in a the first
sector of the first fixed drive. Then it does a bootloader
chain from there to other bootloaders (ie linux lilo can
boot initially then point to ntloader which loads windows).
You have source available for various x86 bootloaders
like lilo, grub, etc to peruse.

On embedded systems there is fixed flash hardware
and you can look at the source for u-boot, redboot,
and many others.

If you have not tried the linuxfromscratch exercise,
that is very interesting, especially to understand how
linux and the whole GNU toolchain works.

http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/

The way toolchains work for embedded is very much
like the linuxfromscratch, except building smaller
using tiny libraries (uclibc, newlib etc) and tiny
executables (busybox and the like) and building for
a different target architecture. There is something
called crosstool to assist in building toolchains for
different architectures. If its all for fun you could
for example build an ARM toolchain and load onto
virtual hardware (emulator) and it would be just
like loading onto a PDA or phone.

Just playing with linuxfromscratch can keep one busy
for some time, getting into cross development tools
can keep one busy for a very long time. Building your
own OS from scratch, perhaps you should get someone
to slide pizza under the door every once in a while :)

  -- Doug

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Littlefield, tyler]

rofl, I'll talk my grandma into giving me some pizza...
Last thing, I've been trying to mount my floppy, mount -t vfat /dev/fd0
/media/floppy, no go, fdisk /dev/fd0 won't work either... I'm lost as to
where the floppy drive is...?
Thanks for the help,
Tyler Littlefield
Unlimited horizons head coder.
check out our website:
tysplace.homelinux.net
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message -----
From: Doug Sutherland <doug@proficio.ca>
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux. <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 8:33 PM
Subject: Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help


> If you are building an os for fun, it might be good to use
> an emulator rather than physical hardware. There are
> many around for example bochs will emulate the x86
> hardware, and there are others for ARM and countless
> other architectures.
>
> On x86 the BIOS will expect a bootloader in a the first
> sector of the first fixed drive. Then it does a bootloader
> chain from there to other bootloaders (ie linux lilo can
> boot initially then point to ntloader which loads windows).
> You have source available for various x86 bootloaders
> like lilo, grub, etc to peruse.
>
> On embedded systems there is fixed flash hardware
> and you can look at the source for u-boot, redboot,
> and many others.
>
> If you have not tried the linuxfromscratch exercise,
> that is very interesting, especially to understand how
> linux and the whole GNU toolchain works.
>
> http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/
>
> The way toolchains work for embedded is very much
> like the linuxfromscratch, except building smaller
> using tiny libraries (uclibc, newlib etc) and tiny
> executables (busybox and the like) and building for
> a different target architecture. There is something
> called crosstool to assist in building toolchains for
> different architectures. If its all for fun you could
> for example build an ARM toolchain and load onto
> virtual hardware (emulator) and it would be just
> like loading onto a PDA or phone.
>
> Just playing with linuxfromscratch can keep one busy
> for some time, getting into cross development tools
> can keep one busy for a very long time. Building your
> own OS from scratch, perhaps you should get someone
> to slide pizza under the door every once in a while :)
>
>   -- Doug
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Doug Sutherland]

The mount command usually requires both a device name
and mount point unless the device name is listed in your
/etc/fstab. Look there for the floppy drive info, mine is:

/dev/fd0 /mnt/floppy auto noauto,owner 0 0

To mount this in the fully qualified way would be:
mount /dev/fd0 /mnt/floppy

Note that the file system type is set to auto in /etc/fstab.
It should automagically determine the file system type.
And since it's in fstab, I can also do just

mount /mnt/floppy

Same is true for cdrom and any other mount point,
if they are defined properly in /etc/fstab you can
simply mount the mount name and skip the device.
This assumes that the device exists and there is
proper media inserted etc.

For more info on mounting
http://www.alwanza.com/howto/linux/floppy.html
http://home.ubalt.edu/abento/linux/terminal/mount.html
http://www.itc.virginia.edu/desktop/linux/mount.html

also commands
man mount
man umount
man fstab

And the dosfstools docs for formatting and such
http://www.fifi.org/doc/dosfstools/

I appreciate linux more and more every day, even
still, started with redhat 5 almost 10 years ago, it
gets better all the time. My system is dare I say
more stable than windows will ever be.

  -- Doug

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Littlefield, tyler]

lol, yes, I like the stability of linux.
I'm sorry for all the questions, but when I try to mount my floppy, it
doesn't work, says it can't open, and a few other errors.
now, I'm off to find cmos immages for bochs. whee :)
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
Unlimited horizons head coder.
check out our website:
tysplace.homelinux.net
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message -----
From: Doug Sutherland <doug@proficio.ca>
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux. <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 9:25 PM
Subject: Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help


> The mount command usually requires both a device name
> and mount point unless the device name is listed in your
> /etc/fstab. Look there for the floppy drive info, mine is:
>
> /dev/fd0 /mnt/floppy auto noauto,owner 0 0
>
> To mount this in the fully qualified way would be:
> mount /dev/fd0 /mnt/floppy
>
> Note that the file system type is set to auto in /etc/fstab.
> It should automagically determine the file system type.
> And since it's in fstab, I can also do just
>
> mount /mnt/floppy
>
> Same is true for cdrom and any other mount point,
> if they are defined properly in /etc/fstab you can
> simply mount the mount name and skip the device.
> This assumes that the device exists and there is
> proper media inserted etc.
>
> For more info on mounting
> http://www.alwanza.com/howto/linux/floppy.html
> http://home.ubalt.edu/abento/linux/terminal/mount.html
> http://www.itc.virginia.edu/desktop/linux/mount.html
>
> also commands
> man mount
> man umount
> man fstab
>
> And the dosfstools docs for formatting and such
> http://www.fifi.org/doc/dosfstools/
>
> I appreciate linux more and more every day, even
> still, started with redhat 5 almost 10 years ago, it
> gets better all the time. My system is dare I say
> more stable than windows will ever be.
>
>   -- Doug
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Littlefield, tyler]

Hello,
I tried Chris's idea, and I see a port where power should probably be on the
floppy drive.
Only thing, is I can't find a chord that goes to the power on the floppy.
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
Unlimited horizons head coder.
check out our website:
tysplace.homelinux.net
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message -----
From: Doug Sutherland <doug@proficio.ca>
To: Speakup is a screen review system for Linux. <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 8:33 PM
Subject: Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help


> If you are building an os for fun, it might be good to use
> an emulator rather than physical hardware. There are
> many around for example bochs will emulate the x86
> hardware, and there are others for ARM and countless
> other architectures.
>
> On x86 the BIOS will expect a bootloader in a the first
> sector of the first fixed drive. Then it does a bootloader
> chain from there to other bootloaders (ie linux lilo can
> boot initially then point to ntloader which loads windows).
> You have source available for various x86 bootloaders
> like lilo, grub, etc to peruse.
>
> On embedded systems there is fixed flash hardware
> and you can look at the source for u-boot, redboot,
> and many others.
>
> If you have not tried the linuxfromscratch exercise,
> that is very interesting, especially to understand how
> linux and the whole GNU toolchain works.
>
> http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/
>
> The way toolchains work for embedded is very much
> like the linuxfromscratch, except building smaller
> using tiny libraries (uclibc, newlib etc) and tiny
> executables (busybox and the like) and building for
> a different target architecture. There is something
> called crosstool to assist in building toolchains for
> different architectures. If its all for fun you could
> for example build an ARM toolchain and load onto
> virtual hardware (emulator) and it would be just
> like loading onto a PDA or phone.
>
> Just playing with linuxfromscratch can keep one busy
> for some time, getting into cross development tools
> can keep one busy for a very long time. Building your
> own OS from scratch, perhaps you should get someone
> to slide pizza under the door every once in a while :)
>
>   -- Doug
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Doug Sutherland]

The PC power supply should have many of the larger power
cables for 3.5 inch drives, but also at least one, usually two
of the smaller cables for floppy drive power. If your power
supply doesn't have them, you can get an adapter cable
that converts from the larger size to the smaller. These are
available at most computer stores and large electronics
stores, and there are many online sources for them.

  -- Doug


Littlefield, tyler wrote:
 >  I see a port where power should probably be on the
 > floppy drive. Only thing, is I can't find a chord that goes
 > to the power on the floppy.

Re: slightly o-t, looking for os help

[Doug Sutherland]

As a point of reference, this is one of those power adapter
cables. It plugs into one of the large power cables and
splits it into two of the floppy sized plugs.

http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?Ref=211037&Row=369475&Site=CA

The price is only $2.46 but there is a fixed shipping cost
of $5 per order at that distributer. You should be able to
find the same cable at any computer store though, and the
odds are that your power supply already has a couple of
the smaller plugs.

   -- Doug