PDA hardware

PDA hardware

[cpt.kirk]

I know I was not the designated hardware guy. But in looking arround I
found a SA1100 based board that while not in production may be doable. It
was designed at a university and the schematics are on their web site. I
do have at least some access to pretty high level PCB production. A friend
of Buddy and I is working on building a computer for himself. This is
including his etching his own board. He has indicated a willingness to
help prototype a project along the way.

Kirk Wood
Cpt.Kirk@1tree.net
------------------

Your fly might be open (but don't check it just now).

Re: PDA hardware

[Buddy Brannan]

You'renot talking about that wearable from Australia, are you? I sure
can't remember what the project is called right now--brain's still too
foggy--but it did sound interesting, even if I couldn't get ahold of the
design for the thing. 


-- 
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.

Re: PDA hardware

[Janina Sajka]

Hi, Kirk:

Hmmm. Should this be Texas Kirk as opposed to Ontario Kirk -- Is that
Texas part right?

I have no interest in ownership on the available hardware side. It sounds
like you may move something to prototype fairly quickly. Go for it. I'm
just not in a position to spend a lot of time specifically on this right
now. My product overview would, therefore, take far more time.

Perhaps the best that I can do quickly is to probe and suggest. Let me do
that now and ask a question that hasn't popped up yet.

What is the competition for this PDA?

I would suggest it is not the BNS, but rather devices like the
Parrot. From that vantage point, your list of functions has two clear
advantages to the Parrott -- email and longer battery life.

I would suggest the consideration of three additional features:

Clock/Calendar and the ability to calculate times and dates--plus the
presence of alarms. By calculate I mean divide 1:00 hours and get 0:20
minutes back, etc;

Web Browsing -- with Lynx, probably

Streaming Audio -- which should work OK if not stored locally beyond
what's needed for buffering.

				Janina Sajka, Director
				Information Systems Research & Development
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

janina@afb.net


On Sat, 11 Mar 2000 cpt.kirk@1tree.net wrote:

> I know I was not the designated hardware guy. But in looking arround I
> found a SA1100 based board that while not in production may be doable. It
> was designed at a university and the schematics are on their web site. I
> do have at least some access to pretty high level PCB production. A friend
> of Buddy and I is working on building a computer for himself. This is
> including his etching his own board. He has indicated a willingness to
> help prototype a project along the way.
> 
> Kirk Wood
> Cpt.Kirk@1tree.net
> ------------------
> 
> Your fly might be open (but don't check it just now).
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

Re: PDA hardware

[Buddy Brannan]

I should think we'd be able to have either a modem or ethernet, but...who
knows? I kinda half thought that telnet or ssh would be a given. Haven't
tried any term programs, minicom has me a bit baffled. ...


-- 
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.

Re: PDA hardware

[Buddy Brannan]

I'd think one could do this with any of the available devices, but yes,
I'd considered that a given, that "more" could be used, or something like
that. I dunno. 


-- 
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.

Re: PDA hardware

[Janina Sajka]

Well, I would agree about reading books. But, it should be the new
NISO/Daisy standard -- which is an XML DTD (see http://www.daisy.org).

So far, the only software players specifically for NISO/Daisy are in
Windows--but that has to change! <grin> If someone wants to start working
on a Linux NISO/Daisy reader, I might be able to get some advance material
to test with. Production books will begin rolling later this year on CD
ROM. In Sweden, it'll be over the Internet, by the way.

PS: The NISO/Daisy protocols support both text and recorded audio. Both
and as well as either one or the other.

I realize that the audio part of a NISO/Daisy book raises storage
issues. Let's just leave it at that for now! <grin>


				Janina Sajka, Director
				Information Systems Research & Development
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

janina@afb.net


On Mon, 13 Mar 2000, Bart Bunting wrote:

> 
> another use I'd have for a pda, and this one may also be taken as a
> given.
> 
> to read books, something along the lines of the roadrunner.  e.g. read
> books on the train etc.
> 
> The problem as I see it with most of the pda devices specifically
> designed for blind people so far is that they are too specialised,
> they only offer half the functionallity and you need two or three of
> them to get everything you want, but then you end up with three little
> boxes you are carying arround.  arg!!!
> 
> It would be great to combine them all into one device.
> Bart
> 
> 
> Buddy Brannan writes:
>  > I should think we'd be able to have either a modem or ethernet, but...who
>  > knows? I kinda half thought that telnet or ssh would be a given. Haven't
>  > tried any term programs, minicom has me a bit baffled. ...
>  > 
>  > 
>  > -- 
>  > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
>  > Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
>  > Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
>  > Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

Re: PDA hardware

[Buddy Brannan]

That's pretty interesting that there are only software daisy players for
Windoz, especially since that machine from Visuaid runs Linux. ...


-- 
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.

Re: PDA hardware

[Bart Bunting]

Janina Sajka writes:
*snip*

 > I would suggest the consideration of three additional features:
 > 
 > Clock/Calendar and the ability to calculate times and dates--plus the
 > presence of alarms. By calculate I mean divide 1:00 hours and get 0:20
 > minutes back, etc;
 > 
 > Web Browsing -- with Lynx, probably
 > 
 > Streaming Audio -- which should work OK if not stored locally beyond
 > what's needed for buffering.

I would like to suggest a couple more:

if web browsing is encorperated, then there should be some abillity to
connect to other machines, e.g. telnet ssh etc.  I would also value
the abillity to use the pda to act as a terminal e.g. connect to the serial port of say, a linux box a router etc.

when you talk about email web browsing etc, what did you have in mind
for connection to the net?  a built in modem?

just my two cents worth.

Bart

Re: PDA hardware

[Bart Bunting]

another use I'd have for a pda, and this one may also be taken as a
given.

to read books, something along the lines of the roadrunner.  e.g. read
books on the train etc.

The problem as I see it with most of the pda devices specifically
designed for blind people so far is that they are too specialised,
they only offer half the functionallity and you need two or three of
them to get everything you want, but then you end up with three little
boxes you are carying arround.  arg!!!

It would be great to combine them all into one device.
Bart


Buddy Brannan writes:
 > I should think we'd be able to have either a modem or ethernet, but...who
 > knows? I kinda half thought that telnet or ssh would be a given. Haven't
 > tried any term programs, minicom has me a bit baffled. ...
 > 
 > 
 > -- 
 > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
 > Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
 > Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
 > Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.

Re: PDA hardware

[Janina Sajka]

The sofware player was written by a Swedish company for Daisy. Victor is a
product of Visuaide in Quebec.

Also, it really doesn't surprise me that they would choose to build a
software player in Windows. That's were the users are. Much as you and I
(and a growing number of others) like using Linux, most users are still in
Windows and will be for the immediate future.


				Janina Sajka, Director
				Information Systems Research & Development
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

janina@afb.net


On Sat, 11 Mar 2000, Buddy Brannan wrote:

> That's pretty interesting that there are only software daisy players for
> Windoz, especially since that machine from Visuaid runs Linux. ...
> 
> 
> -- 
> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV        | Friday whistle, how did I make it?
> Email: davros@ycardz.com     | If I had my way, I'd run out naked!
> Phone: (972) 889-8147        | Banging pub doors, hey! Let me in!
> Voice mail: (877) 791-5298   | Gimme my blue jeans again.
> 

Daisy standard software

[cpt.kirk]

Janina,

Is the standard for the book an open standard? That would certainly make
creating a Linux based reader easier. Also it would then be less risky.
Don't know if you have payed much attention to it. But I would hate to end
up in the same boat as the poor guy who dared to post code to play DVD
movies. Not that I think that there would be the same level of insanity,
but it does stop and make me think.

Kirk Wood
Cpt.Kirk@1tree.net
------------------

Your fly might be open (but don't check it just now).

Re: Daisy standard software

[Janina Sajka]

Hi, Kirk:

The simple and complete answer to your question is "yes," the NISO/Daisy
standards are open and standards. Now, as to what exactly they'll be
issued under -- let me remember to ask that at our meetings this coming
weekend. 


				Janina Sajka, Director
				Information Systems Research & Development
				American Foundation for the Blind (AFB)

janina@afb.net


On Tue, 14 Mar 2000 cpt.kirk@1tree.net wrote:

> Janina,
> 
> Is the standard for the book an open standard? That would certainly make
> creating a Linux based reader easier. Also it would then be less risky.
> Don't know if you have payed much attention to it. But I would hate to end
> up in the same boat as the poor guy who dared to post code to play DVD
> movies. Not that I think that there would be the same level of insanity,
> but it does stop and make me think.
> 
> Kirk Wood
> Cpt.Kirk@1tree.net
> ------------------
> 
> Your fly might be open (but don't check it just now).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

PDA hardware

[cpt.kirk]

Ok, here is where I am at on my hardware survey so far. There are two
options that I see as viable choices to head towards currently. I will
list each with the observations I have concerning them. More feedback is,
of course, welcome. In fact, that is the whole point.

Motorolla MC68000 series processor
This is the family that the Palm pilots work on. There are several readily
available platforms to work with on the market to adapt to our use. The
lowest cost option being the handspring Visor retailing for about $150.
This has a USB interface and a propriatary (though accessible) expansion
slot. Used Palms can be purchased, and one company offers souped up Palms
though the cost goes up to about $850.

There is a version of Linux available for this platform. (www.uclinux.org)
The version of Linux can be placed as the native OS on the enhanced Palms
that I mentioned going from $450 to $850. One can get any of the devices
to load Linux though. Also, there is a emulator available to experiment
and develop with. The Linux distro does run on the emulation package.

Also, the organization behind the distro is selling simm packages that
will run Linux for $210. It has one serial port. Other IO may be adaptable
to feed a doubletalk synth. Speakup will probably need some porting work
to run on this platform. Upgrades are going to be quite limited.

Intel X86
I think most of us are well aware of this platform. Prices for a board of
usable power consumption and size range from $150 up. The $150 board would
be a 386 with 2 MB ram. There is a distribution that will run under such
(www.etlinux.org). There is no choice but to do some hardware work with
this, but I honestly think it is surmountable. Also all prices I have
quoted are single quantity pricing. A price break would be seen at 5 to
10 units.

Most all of the x86 borads come with 2 serial ports. Ethernet controllers
are also available and solid state storage can go as large as 240 MB
currently. Addition of a notebook type hard drive is possible (though at
the expense of battery life and weight). I honestly think a 486 unit with
16 MB ram and 16 MB solid state hard drive can be built for $500 in single
quantitys. Understand that options will add cost. That price is not
including a modem. But modem and or a ethernet card can be added for about
$100.

Also, the x86 platform has an advantage in that I am familiar with the
platform. The amount of porting will be minimized.


One last note:
If I don't respond to a particular message concerning the PDA, it does not
mean that I haven't read and considered what was said. Money permitting I
will have something that has speech output and some form of braille input
by late summer. Also, I will shortly repost what I have so far in the way
of what to include.

Kirk Wood
Cpt.Kirk@1tree.net
------------------

Your fly might be open (but don't check it just now).