Re: Links the chain

Re: Links the chain

[LARRY SKUTCHAN]

Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)

Thanks.


>>> janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.

Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.

Sorry.

Luke Yelavich writes:
> On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
> > Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the 
> > chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like to 
> > have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a 
> > way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the website. 
> > Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
> 
> Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
> options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
> options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
> type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
> the last options in this window.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Luke
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Chair
				Accessibility Workgroup
				Free Standards Group (FSG)

janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Links the chain

[Janina Sajka]

Hey, Larry: Welcome to the Speakup list! How delightful to see you here.
Do you find Speakup hauntingly familiar? I'd say that was a good thing,
myself! <grin>

As for differences between the cat and the chain ...

At this point I'm not sure there is much. I still use the cat, but
probably because I've used it for years and it works very well in most
situations.

Both of them require appropriate configuration settings to be blind
friendly. But, once you do that, they can appear and act very much the
same as it seems you've discovered.

Perhaps someone who's used the chain more than I have can expostulate on
some of the subtelties. But my bottom line is that the chain's
developers have done a pretty good job of adding the kind of blind
friendly functionality that has proven so valuable.

Perhaps the biggest difference is that the chain is in active
development and the cat is not--with the possible exception of one local
effort.




LARRY SKUTCHAN writes:
> Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> >>> janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
> Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.
> 
> Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> Luke Yelavich writes:
> > On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
> > > Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the 
> > > chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like to 
> > > have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a 
> > > way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the website. 
> > > Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
> > 
> > Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
> > options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
> > options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
> > type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
> > the last options in this window.
> > 
> > Hope this helps.
> > 
> > Luke
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 
> 
> -- 
> 	
> 				Janina Sajka, Chair
> 				Accessibility Workgroup
> 				Free Standards Group (FSG)
> 
> janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Chair
				Accessibility Workgroup
				Free Standards Group (FSG)

janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040

Re: Links the chain

[Ryan Mann]

Also, Links the chain supports some Javascript.


On Thu, 14 Oct 2004, Janina Sajka wrote:

> Hey, Larry: Welcome to the Speakup list! How delightful to see you here.
> Do you find Speakup hauntingly familiar? I'd say that was a good thing,
> myself! <grin>
> 
> As for differences between the cat and the chain ...
> 
> At this point I'm not sure there is much. I still use the cat, but
> probably because I've used it for years and it works very well in most
> situations.
> 
> Both of them require appropriate configuration settings to be blind
> friendly. But, once you do that, they can appear and act very much the
> same as it seems you've discovered.
> 
> Perhaps someone who's used the chain more than I have can expostulate on
> some of the subtelties. But my bottom line is that the chain's
> developers have done a pretty good job of adding the kind of blind
> friendly functionality that has proven so valuable.
> 
> Perhaps the biggest difference is that the chain is in active
> development and the cat is not--with the possible exception of one local
> effort.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LARRY SKUTCHAN writes:
> > Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)
> > 
> > Thanks.
> > 
> > 
> > >>> janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
> > Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.
> > 
> > Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.
> > 
> > Sorry.
> > 
> > Luke Yelavich writes:
> > > On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
> > > > Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the 
> > > > chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like to 
> > > > have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a 
> > > > way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the website. 
> > > > Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
> > > 
> > > Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
> > > options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
> > > options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
> > > type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
> > > the last options in this window.
> > > 
> > > Hope this helps.
> > > 
> > > Luke
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Speakup mailing list
> > > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 
> > 
> > -- 
> > 	
> > 				Janina Sajka, Chair
> > 				Accessibility Workgroup
> > 				Free Standards Group (FSG)
> > 
> > janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> -- 
> 	
> 				Janina Sajka, Chair
> 				Accessibility Workgroup
> 				Free Standards Group (FSG)
> 
> janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

Re: Links the chain

[Luke Yelavich]

On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 11:56:34PM EST, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Perhaps someone who's used the chain more than I have can expostulate on
> some of the subtelties. But my bottom line is that the chain's
> developers have done a pretty good job of adding the kind of blind
> friendly functionality that has proven so valuable.

There are a few differences indeed. For a start, links the chain has a
menu-like system for controlling options etc, which appear in dialog
boxes. However, this interface is simplified a lot if one turns on the
Braille Terminal mode from the terminal options in the settings menu.
For those who want to know how to turn it on, load links, press ALT + S,
then T. Press the up arrow 3 times, and press the space bar to check the
option. Then simply press enter. Don't forget to save your options by
pressing ALT + S, then S.

Links the chain supports both frames and tables, although I personally
have these turned off, since I am used to reading pages in a linear
fashion, although this doesn't always help with data tables, but since I
don't really have to read any of these, there is no big deal.

Links the chain supports JavaScript. Note that JavaScript is very much
different to Java, which is in fact not supported by ANY text browser at
all. This is helpful for some dynamic content sites that implement the
use of JavaScript a lot, however I have found a few bugs in the links
JavaScript code. :)

Links the chain does not have very good cookie support however. This is
where I need to use lynx the cat for such sites.

I hope all this helps

Luke

Re: Links the chain

[Karen Lewellen]

Greetings larry,
  I too bid you welcome to the list.  I offer this difference  hoping that 
others will either confirm  or explain this fact.  I use a Linux shell 
that  has both the cat and the chain,  and given that some here have said 
that they should work almost exactly the same suspect that all that could 
be done to  the chain has perhaps not been done.  Still the main difference 
is the in  the chain edition one can access java sites, or can do some in 
a way.  I do come across some that do not budge regardless, but again this 
may be a configuration factor.
I am told that the cat even with ssl enabled now does not or <cannot?> 
have java incorporated because no one wants to take the time.    or better 
that it would take too much time to re-vamp the code for this.  I  am only 
sharing what I have been told, and would love to hear otherwise Given the 
popularity of the cat,  adding this feature would be  a wonderful thing, 
as even those  who might not seek it out on their own, using IE or 
Netscape know of the cat and think it far more limiting     than it 
actually is in 
real use.
   The chain is not as well known.
looking forward to the wisdom on this.
Karen

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004, LARRY SKUTCHAN wrote:

> Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>>>> janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
> Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.
>
> Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.
>
> Sorry.
>
> Luke Yelavich writes:
>> On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
>>> Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the
>>> chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like to
>>> have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a
>>> way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the website.
>>> Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
>>
>> Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
>> options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
>> options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
>> type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
>> the last options in this window.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> Luke
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> -- 
>
> 				Janina Sajka, Chair
> 				Accessibility Workgroup
> 				Free Standards Group (FSG)
>
> janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: Links the chain

[Janina Sajka]

Slight correction, Karen. It's not java sites we access with the chain,
but javascript sites.

Unfortunately, these two are not the same thing. Ten years ago Netscape
saw fit to start using the term "javascript" for their scripting
language. This was in the early days of Sun Microsystems promotion of
Java. Seems they wanted the glitz to rub off on Netscape. Ever since
we've had to explain this difference away.

Karen Lewellen writes:
> Greetings larry,
>  I too bid you welcome to the list.  I offer this difference  hoping that 
> others will either confirm  or explain this fact.  I use a Linux shell 
> that  has both the cat and the chain,  and given that some here have said 
> that they should work almost exactly the same suspect that all that could 
> be done to  the chain has perhaps not been done.  Still the main difference 
> is the in  the chain edition one can access java sites, or can do some in 
> a way.  I do come across some that do not budge regardless, but again this 
> may be a configuration factor.
> I am told that the cat even with ssl enabled now does not or <cannot?> 
> have java incorporated because no one wants to take the time.    or better 
> that it would take too much time to re-vamp the code for this.  I  am only 
> sharing what I have been told, and would love to hear otherwise Given the 
> popularity of the cat,  adding this feature would be  a wonderful thing, 
> as even those  who might not seek it out on their own, using IE or 
> Netscape know of the cat and think it far more limiting     than it 
> actually is in 
> real use.
>   The chain is not as well known.
> looking forward to the wisdom on this.
> Karen
> 
> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004, LARRY SKUTCHAN wrote:
> 
> >Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the 
> >advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem 
> >pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty 
> >good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to 
> >navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >
> >>>>janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
> >Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.
> >
> >Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.
> >
> >Sorry.
> >
> >Luke Yelavich writes:
> >>On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
> >>>Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the
> >>>chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like 
> >>>to
> >>>have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a
> >>>way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the 
> >>>website.
> >>>Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
> >>
> >>Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
> >>options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
> >>options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
> >>type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
> >>the last options in this window.
> >>
> >>Hope this helps.
> >>
> >>Luke
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Speakup mailing list
> >>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >-- 
> >
> >				Janina Sajka, Chair
> >				Accessibility Workgroup
> >				Free Standards Group (FSG)
> >
> >janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Speakup mailing list
> >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Speakup mailing list
> >Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Chair
				Accessibility Workgroup
				Free Standards Group (FSG)

janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040

Re: Links the chain

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

In fact, I recall hearing that there was legal action by Sun Micro
Systems against Netscape, to make them rename java script, but I guess
it must have failed, or what I heard was wrong.

Greg


On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 12:35:22PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Slight correction, Karen. It's not java sites we access with the chain,
> but javascript sites.
> 
> Unfortunately, these two are not the same thing. Ten years ago Netscape
> saw fit to start using the term "javascript" for their scripting
> language. This was in the early days of Sun Microsystems promotion of
> Java. Seems they wanted the glitz to rub off on Netscape. Ever since
> we've had to explain this difference away.
> 

- -- 
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
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Re: Links the chain

[Janina Sajka]

My memory is hazy on that, Gregg, but I think they eventually discovered
they had more in to gain fro cooperation.

I do, however, want to suggest something to everyone. If you try to use
a hyprelink and it won't work in the cat, Take at look at it with
the capital E command. Here's an example I just came across on the
Montgomery County web site. This is for a url to take you to the U.S.
Government's web pages:

javascript:openScript('/redirect.asp?redirect=http://www.firstgov.gov',650,450)

To my mind it's an outstanding example of bad coding practice. What's
the point? HTML already provides a perfectly usable hyperlinking
feature. In fact, the above syntax only wraps the inherent HTML
functionality.

So, what's the tip? You can edit off the extra junk and get a perfectly
usable link. Or, you can just use the Speakup clipboard to grab the href
and go there directly with the g command.

Gregory Nowak writes:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> In fact, I recall hearing that there was legal action by Sun Micro
> Systems against Netscape, to make them rename java script, but I guess
> it must have failed, or what I heard was wrong.
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 12:35:22PM -0400, Janina Sajka wrote:
> > Slight correction, Karen. It's not java sites we access with the chain,
> > but javascript sites.
> > 
> > Unfortunately, these two are not the same thing. Ten years ago Netscape
> > saw fit to start using the term "javascript" for their scripting
> > language. This was in the early days of Sun Microsystems promotion of
> > Java. Seems they wanted the glitz to rub off on Netscape. Ever since
> > we've had to explain this difference away.

Speech synth

[David Link]

Hello,

for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks, with best regards,

David Link

_______

Hallo,

fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist willkommen!

Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,

David Link
___
David Link
Alpha60 technologies
Lütticher Str. 34
50674 Köln
T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
E: david@khm.de
W: http://alpha60.de

Re: Speech synth

[Janina Sajka]

Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
well.

I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
donations?

David Link writes:
> Hello,
> 
> for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
> Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
> speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
> over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
> you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
> them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
> evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
> 
> Thanks, with best regards,
> 
> David Link
> 
> _______
> 
> Hallo,
> 
> fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
> Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
> sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
> die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
> Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
> Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
> eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist willkommen!
> 
> Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
> 
> David Link
> ___
> David Link
> Alpha60 technologies
> Lütticher Str. 34
> 50674 Köln
> T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
> E: david@khm.de
> W: http://alpha60.de
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Chair
				Accessibility Workgroup
				Free Standards Group (FSG)

janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040

Re: Speech synth

[David Link]

Dear Janina,

I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy units for 
a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is very welcome!

Thanks, with best regards,

David

Janina Sajka wrote:

>Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
>life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
>well.
>
>I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
>donations?
>
>David Link writes:
>  
>
>>Hello,
>>
>>for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
>>Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
>>speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
>>over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
>>you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
>>them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
>>evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
>>
>>Thanks, with best regards,
>>
>>David Link
>>
>>_______
>>
>>Hallo,
>>
>>fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
>>Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
>>sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
>>die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
>>Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
>>Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
>>eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist willkommen!
>>
>>Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
>>
>>David Link
>>___
>>David Link
>>Alpha60 technologies
>>Lütticher Str. 34
>>50674 Köln
>>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>E: david@khm.de
>>W: http://alpha60.de
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Speakup mailing list
>>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>    
>>
>
>  
>


-- 
___
David Link
Alpha60 technologies
Lütticher Str. 34
50674 Köln
T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
E: david@khm.de
W: http://alpha60.de

Re: Speech synth

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.  You might want to look on ebay.  I got my DECtalk express for $200
U.S.  I needed to buy a cable that cost me an additional $30 U.S.
including shipping.  The unit works fine.  It's become my default synth.

Hope this helps.
          Kenny

On Fri, Oct 15, 2004 at 01:23:18PM +0200, David Link wrote:
> Dear Janina,
> 
> I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy units for 
> a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is very welcome!
> 
> Thanks, with best regards,
> 
> David
> 
> Janina Sajka wrote:
> 
> >Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
> >life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
> >well.
> >
> >I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
> >donations?
> >
> >David Link writes:
> > 
> >
> >>Hello,
> >>
> >>for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
> >>Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
> >>speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
> >>over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
> >>you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
> >>them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
> >>evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
> >>
> >>Thanks, with best regards,
> >>
> >>David Link
> >>
> >>_______
> >>
> >>Hallo,
> >>
> >>fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
> >>Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
> >>sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
> >>die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
> >>Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
> >>Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
> >>eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist 
> >>willkommen!
> >>
> >>Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
> >>
> >>David Link
> >>___
> >>David Link
> >>Alpha60 technologies
> >>Lütticher Str. 34
> >>50674 Köln
> >>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
> >>E: david@khm.de
> >>W: http://alpha60.de
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Speakup mailing list
> >>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >>   
> >>
> >
> > 
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> ___
> David Link
> Alpha60 technologies
> Lütticher Str. 34
> 50674 Köln
> T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
> E: david@khm.de
> W: http://alpha60.de
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: Speech synth

[Janina Sajka]

Hi, David:

OK. I would do any combination of:

1.)	Doubletalk units (including perhaps only the internal boards
which you could breadboard) from the manufacturer:

	http://www.rcsys.com

2.)	Finding used units via E-Bay (and similar) as previously
suggested.

3.)	Using software speech through multiple sound cards. Options
include:

	http://www.cepstral.com
	http://www.fonix.com/page.cfm?name=product_dectalk_rt_for_linux&ID=15

I would suggest #3 may be the more interesting way to achieve what you
want, because you could get a variety of voices (Festival/Flite,
Mbrolla, JavaTTS) at no cost.

Good luck!

David Link writes:
> Dear Janina,
> 
> I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy units for 
> a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is very welcome!
> 
> Thanks, with best regards,
> 
> David
> 
> Janina Sajka wrote:
> 
> >Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
> >life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
> >well.
> >
> >I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
> >donations?
> >
> >David Link writes:
> > 
> >
> >>Hello,
> >>
> >>for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
> >>Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
> >>speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
> >>over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
> >>you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
> >>them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
> >>evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
> >>
> >>Thanks, with best regards,
> >>
> >>David Link
> >>
> >>_______
> >>
> >>Hallo,
> >>
> >>fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
> >>Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
> >>sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
> >>die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
> >>Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
> >>Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
> >>eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist 
> >>willkommen!
> >>
> >>Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
> >>
> >>David Link
> >>___
> >>David Link
> >>Alpha60 technologies
> >>Lütticher Str. 34
> >>50674 Köln
> >>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
> >>E: david@khm.de
> >>W: http://alpha60.de
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Speakup mailing list
> >>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >>   
> >>
> >
> > 
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> ___
> David Link
> Alpha60 technologies
> Lütticher Str. 34
> 50674 Köln
> T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
> E: david@khm.de
> W: http://alpha60.de
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

-- 
	
				Janina Sajka, Chair
				Accessibility Workgroup
				Free Standards Group (FSG)

janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040

Re: Speech synth

[DL]

Hello Janina and all the others,

I have a few boxes now and a few problems. Does anybody of you know how 
to set the default language on a keynote gold sa by sending ascii 
commands over the serial line? There must be a command set, but I can't 
find it. Also, I am trying to make speak a Infovox 700. Unlike the 
others, sending it ascii text is not enough. Or does it use very strange 
serial parameters?

Thanks for your help,

David

Janina Sajka wrote:

>Hi, David:
>
>OK. I would do any combination of:
>
>1.)	Doubletalk units (including perhaps only the internal boards
>which you could breadboard) from the manufacturer:
>
>	http://www.rcsys.com
>
>2.)	Finding used units via E-Bay (and similar) as previously
>suggested.
>
>3.)	Using software speech through multiple sound cards. Options
>include:
>
>	http://www.cepstral.com
>	http://www.fonix.com/page.cfm?name=product_dectalk_rt_for_linux&ID=15
>
>I would suggest #3 may be the more interesting way to achieve what you
>want, because you could get a variety of voices (Festival/Flite,
>Mbrolla, JavaTTS) at no cost.
>
>Good luck!
>
>David Link writes:
>  
>
>>Dear Janina,
>>
>>I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy units for 
>>a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is very welcome!
>>
>>Thanks, with best regards,
>>
>>David
>>
>>Janina Sajka wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
>>>life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
>>>well.
>>>
>>>I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
>>>donations?
>>>
>>>David Link writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
>>>>Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
>>>>speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
>>>>over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar that 
>>>>you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to get 
>>>>them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk 
>>>>evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
>>>>
>>>>Thanks, with best regards,
>>>>
>>>>David Link
>>>>
>>>>_______
>>>>
>>>>Hallo,
>>>>
>>>>fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
>>>>Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
>>>>sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
>>>>die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
>>>>Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
>>>>Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
>>>>eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist 
>>>>willkommen!
>>>>
>>>>Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
>>>>
>>>>David Link
>>>>___
>>>>David Link
>>>>Alpha60 technologies
>>>>Lütticher Str. 34
>>>>50674 Köln
>>>>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>>>E: david@khm.de
>>>>W: http://alpha60.de
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Speakup mailing list
>>>>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>-- 
>>___
>>David Link
>>Alpha60 technologies
>>Lütticher Str. 34
>>50674 Köln
>>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>E: david@khm.de
>>W: http://alpha60.de
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Speakup mailing list
>>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>    
>>
>
>  
>

Re: Speech synth

[hank]

um keynote sa? um dude what command did you use to get that thingy working 
with speakup?
last I checked it wasn't supported I am refering to the external keynote.
where can I get a updated list of this stuff at?
thanks
hank
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "DL" <david@khm.de>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: Speech synth


> Hello Janina and all the others,
>
> I have a few boxes now and a few problems. Does anybody of you know how to 
> set the default language on a keynote gold sa by sending ascii commands 
> over the serial line? There must be a command set, but I can't find it. 
> Also, I am trying to make speak a Infovox 700. Unlike the others, sending 
> it ascii text is not enough. Or does it use very strange serial 
> parameters?
>
> Thanks for your help,
>
> David
>
> Janina Sajka wrote:
>
>>Hi, David:
>>
>>OK. I would do any combination of:
>>
>>1.) Doubletalk units (including perhaps only the internal boards
>>which you could breadboard) from the manufacturer:
>>
>> http://www.rcsys.com
>>
>>2.) Finding used units via E-Bay (and similar) as previously
>>suggested.
>>
>>3.) Using software speech through multiple sound cards. Options
>>include:
>>
>> http://www.cepstral.com
>> http://www.fonix.com/page.cfm?name=product_dectalk_rt_for_linux&amp;ID=15
>>
>>I would suggest #3 may be the more interesting way to achieve what you
>>want, because you could get a variety of voices (Festival/Flite,
>>Mbrolla, JavaTTS) at no cost.
>>
>>Good luck!
>>
>>David Link writes:
>>
>>>Dear Janina,
>>>
>>>I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy units for 
>>>a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is very welcome!
>>>
>>>Thanks, with best regards,
>>>
>>>David
>>>
>>>Janina Sajka wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it for dear
>>>>life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it working
>>>>well.
>>>>
>>>>I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
>>>>donations?
>>>>
>>>>David Link writes:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>>for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der Kriegsblinden), 
>>>>>Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for English 
>>>>>speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that can be driven 
>>>>>over the serial interface. Do you have such hardware in your cellar 
>>>>>that you could donate or sell to us? Do you have hints for us where to 
>>>>>get them, especially in Europe? I have a DecTalk ISA card and the 
>>>>>DoubleTalk evaluation board. Any help would be appreciated!
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks, with best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>David Link
>>>>>
>>>>>_______
>>>>>
>>>>>Hallo,
>>>>>
>>>>>fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
>>>>>Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
>>>>>sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das ueber 
>>>>>die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt Ihr noch alte 
>>>>>Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / verkaufen koenntet? Habt 
>>>>>Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher 
>>>>>eine DecTalk ISA Karte und das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist 
>>>>>willkommen!
>>>>>
>>>>>Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
>>>>>
>>>>>David Link
>>>>>___
>>>>>David Link
>>>>>Alpha60 technologies
>>>>>Lütticher Str. 34
>>>>>50674 Köln
>>>>>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>>>>E: david@khm.de
>>>>>W: http://alpha60.de
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Speakup mailing list
>>>>>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>>>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>-- 
>>>___
>>>David Link
>>>Alpha60 technologies
>>>Lütticher Str. 34
>>>50674 Köln
>>>T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>>E: david@khm.de
>>>W: http://alpha60.de
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Speakup mailing list
>>>Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: Speech synth

[DL]

i just send it ascii text over serial and it reads it - smile ...

hank wrote:

> um keynote sa? um dude what command did you use to get that thingy 
> working with speakup?
> last I checked it wasn't supported I am refering to the external keynote.
> where can I get a updated list of this stuff at?
> thanks
> hank
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "DL" <david@khm.de>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 3:14 PM
> Subject: Re: Speech synth
>
>
>> Hello Janina and all the others,
>>
>> I have a few boxes now and a few problems. Does anybody of you know 
>> how to set the default language on a keynote gold sa by sending ascii 
>> commands over the serial line? There must be a command set, but I 
>> can't find it. Also, I am trying to make speak a Infovox 700. Unlike 
>> the others, sending it ascii text is not enough. Or does it use very 
>> strange serial parameters?
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>>
>> David
>>
>> Janina Sajka wrote:
>>
>>> Hi, David:
>>>
>>> OK. I would do any combination of:
>>>
>>> 1.) Doubletalk units (including perhaps only the internal boards
>>> which you could breadboard) from the manufacturer:
>>>
>>> http://www.rcsys.com
>>>
>>> 2.) Finding used units via E-Bay (and similar) as previously
>>> suggested.
>>>
>>> 3.) Using software speech through multiple sound cards. Options
>>> include:
>>>
>>> http://www.cepstral.com
>>> http://www.fonix.com/page.cfm?name=product_dectalk_rt_for_linux&amp;ID=15 
>>>
>>>
>>> I would suggest #3 may be the more interesting way to achieve what you
>>> want, because you could get a variety of voices (Festival/Flite,
>>> Mbrolla, JavaTTS) at no cost.
>>>
>>> Good luck!
>>>
>>> David Link writes:
>>>
>>>> Dear Janina,
>>>>
>>>> I understand that very well. I would also be interested to buy 
>>>> units for a decent price (not the dectalk pricing :-). Any help is 
>>>> very welcome!
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, with best regards,
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>> Janina Sajka wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Actually, most of us who have equipment like this hold on to it 
>>>>> for dear
>>>>> life. It's our interface to Linux, so we do our best to keep it 
>>>>> working
>>>>> well.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know where you could buy units, but I think you're looking for
>>>>> donations?
>>>>>
>>>>> David Link writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> for a concert project of FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
>>>>>> Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell and David Link we are searching for 
>>>>>> English speech-synthesizers, preferably as external module that 
>>>>>> can be driven over the serial interface. Do you have such 
>>>>>> hardware in your cellar that you could donate or sell to us? Do 
>>>>>> you have hints for us where to get them, especially in Europe? I 
>>>>>> have a DecTalk ISA card and the DoubleTalk evaluation board. Any 
>>>>>> help would be appreciated!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks, with best regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David Link
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hallo,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> fuer ein Konzertprojekt von FM Einheit (Hoerspielpreis der 
>>>>>> Kriegsblinden), Jamie Lidell und David Link suchen wir englisch 
>>>>>> sprachige Sprach-Synthesizer, bevorzugt als externes Modul, das 
>>>>>> ueber die serielle Schnittstelle angesteuert werden kann. Habt 
>>>>>> Ihr noch alte Geraete im Keller, die Ihr uns ueberlassen / 
>>>>>> verkaufen koenntet? Habt Ihr Hinweise auf solche Geraete? 
>>>>>> Europaeische Haendler? Ich habe bisher eine DecTalk ISA Karte und 
>>>>>> das DoubleTalk Board. Jede Hilfe ist willkommen!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vielen Dank und schoene Gruesse,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David Link
>>>>>> ___
>>>>>> David Link
>>>>>> Alpha60 technologies
>>>>>> Lütticher Str. 34
>>>>>> 50674 Köln
>>>>>> T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>>>>> E: david@khm.de
>>>>>> W: http://alpha60.de
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Speakup mailing list
>>>>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> ___
>>>> David Link
>>>> Alpha60 technologies
>>>> Lütticher Str. 34
>>>> 50674 Köln
>>>> T: ++49 .173 .244 81 57
>>>> E: david@khm.de
>>>> W: http://alpha60.de
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Speakup mailing list
>>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: Links the chain

[Kenny Hitt]

Hi.  Links (the chain) has a confusing history.  The links2.1 program
most people mean when they say "links" is a program based on another
program called links.  the origional links was written by a Check
physicist for his personal use.  I believe the latest version is still
at 0.99.  The links 2.1 program most people use was based on the
origional links and branched off at links 0.97.  Links 2.1 has
javascript support, but it was written from scratch and doesn't
implement the latest official standard for javascript.  Also, since the
origional links didn't have all the features needed in a modern browser,
it will run into problems on javascript sites even if it's javascript
works corectly.  Links 0.97 didn't have support for cookies, http
authorization, and did other things to hide data from sites you visit
with it.  The site for links 0.99 is:

http://artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~mikulas/vyplody/links/

To add to the confusion, there is another child of the origional links
browser.  This one is called elinks.  Elinks has changed the most from
the origional links code.  It started because the developer of elinks
submited patches to add features to the origional links.  The developer
of the origional links wasn't interested in them, so the elinks
developer started his own browser based on the origional source.
Javascript support is just now being added to elinks.  The developers
wanted to wait until the had DOM and CSS support in elinks before
starting to add javascript support.  The javascript support in elinks
usees the spidermonkey javascript interpreter.  Links 2.1 uses an
interpreter written from scratch.  This makes it hard to maintain or
modify.  The javascript support in elinks is still in early development,
so you might get better results on javascript sites with links 2.1.  It will
depend on whether the site uses other things not supported by links 2.1.
The developer of links 2.1 seems more interested in adding graphic
features than updating the javascript, so I believe elinks will turn out
to be the best console browser.  The web site for elinks is:

http://elinks.or.cz

Lynx (the cat) doesn't seem to be geting the same amount of development
as elinks.  It might be posible to add javascript support to it, but the
official developers don't seem to be interested.
Personally, I use either elinks or lynx (the cat).  Elinks has features
I don't find in other console browsers.

Hope this helps.
          Kenny
	  
On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:38:07AM -0400, LARRY SKUTCHAN wrote:
> Speaking of Lynx and Links, can some of you experts discuss what the advantages and disadvantages are of each of them.  As a newbie, they seem pretty darn similar to me.  I have also noticed that W3m looks pretty good, and it has the cool feature of letting you use the arrow keys to navigate the document.  (It uses Tab to move from link to link.)
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> >>> janina@rednote.net Thursday, October 14, 2004 9:23:16 AM >>>
> Oops. I totaly missed seeing that.
> 
> Guess I need another pot of coffee this morning.
> 
> Sorry.
> 
> Luke Yelavich writes:
> > On Thu, Oct 14, 2004 at 09:10:54PM EST, Leslie Fairall wrote:
> > > Does anyone know if you can change the user-agent string in links the 
> > > chain? I use the cat with Bank of America by doing this, but would like to 
> > > have access to some features that require Javascript. I wish there was a 
> > > way where I could save the user-agent string whenever I go to the website. 
> > > Does anyone else do the same thing? Thanks.
> > 
> > Yes you can do this. Go into the settings menu, and choose the network
> > options. A quick way is simply to press ALT + S, then N. Find the HTTP
> > options, and press enter on it. In there, there is a field that you can
> > type in a different user agent. It is called fake user agent, and one of
> > the last options in this window.
> > 
> > Hope this helps.
> > 
> > Luke
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 
> 
> -- 
> 	
> 				Janina Sajka, Chair
> 				Accessibility Workgroup
> 				Free Standards Group (FSG)
> 
> janina@freestandards.org	Phone: +1 202.494.7040
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca 
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup