Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

[Darragh]

Hello,

I am trying to get speech dispatcher working.

I have festival installed and while in festival using the SayText command
works. 

However, I receive the following error when trying to get spd-say to run:
client: Speech Dispatcher failed to open: Connection refused

I'm using SuSE 10.2 and I have both speech dispatcher and speech_up
installed.  

I will try installing the flite synth in a few minutes but I'd really like
to know what's happening here.

I've edited the speech.conf file and the /modules/festival.conf file  as
well.  There were a few lines I had to uncomment in the festival.conf file.
I'm not sure if I've done this right as the creen reader I'm working really
doesn't like reading text off a remote terminal screen.  

Any help appreciated.


Darragh

Re: Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

It sounds like speech-dispatcher isn't running. You need to start it
up, however you start a service on suse, and look for any errors if it
still isn't running after you've started it.

Greg


On Sun, Sep 09, 2007 at 12:03:55AM +0100, Darragh wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I am trying to get speech dispatcher working.
> 
> I have festival installed and while in festival using the SayText command
> works. 
> 
> However, I receive the following error when trying to get spd-say to run:
> client: Speech Dispatcher failed to open: Connection refused
> 
> I'm using SuSE 10.2 and I have both speech dispatcher and speech_up
> installed.  
> 
> I will try installing the flite synth in a few minutes but I'd really like
> to know what's happening here.
> 
> I've edited the speech.conf file and the /modules/festival.conf file  as
> well.  There were a few lines I had to uncomment in the festival.conf file.
> I'm not sure if I've done this right as the creen reader I'm working really
> doesn't like reading text off a remote terminal screen.  
> 
> Any help appreciated.
> 
> 
> Darragh
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

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RE: Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

[Darragh]

Hello again,

When I run speech-dispatcher -d I get the following output.  Any
suggestions?

One of my problems here are that I'm using Putty from a windows box to ssh
into my linux machine as I don't have any screen reader available there at
the moment so I cant really go through the conf file with any degree of
certainty that I'm on the right line.  Perhaps someone could send their
speech.conf and festival.conf file for speech dispatcher to me?  My address
is lists@digitaldarragh.com

I'm sorry.  I know this is probably easy enough to fix but the lack of a
screen reader on my laptop is really causing me problems.  I'm driving my
girl friend nuts by asking her to read the screen when something happens I
cant look at using putty.  

Here is the output from speech-dispatcher -d

Last login: Sun Sep  9 14:05:49 2007
Have a lot of fun...
laptop:~ #
laptop:~ # speech-dispatcher  -d
Error: can't open logging file! Using stdout.
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 890866] speechd:  Speech Dispatcher Logging to
file /var/log/speech-dispatcher/speechd.log
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 891194] speechd: ERROR: Openning debug file for
Festival failed: (error=-1) No such file or directory
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 891281] speechd:  Initializing output module
Festival with binary /usr/local/lib/speech-dispatcher-modules//sd_Festival
and configuration /usr/local/etc/speech-dispatcher/modules//Festival.conf
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 891367] speechd:  Output module is logging to
standard error output (stderr)
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 896056] speechd:  Module Festival loaded.
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 903617] speechd: ERROR: Bad syntax from output
module Festival 1
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 903775] speechd:   Couldn't load specified
output module
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 904010] speechd: ERROR: Openning debug file for
festival failed: (error=-1) No such file or directory
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 904095] speechd:  Initializing output module
festival with binary /usr/local/lib/speech-dispatcher-modules//sd_festival
and configuration /usr/local/etc/speech-dispatcher/modules//festival.conf
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 904180] speechd:  Output module is logging to
standard error output (stderr)
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 908026] speechd:  Module festival loaded.
festival_client: connect to server failed
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 944546] speechd: ERROR: Module festival failed
to initialize. Reason:
---------------
Communicating with Festival through a socket. Can't connect to Festival
server. Check your configuration in etc/speechd-modules/festival.conf for
the specified host and port and check if Festival is really running there,
e.g. with telnet. Please see documentation for more info.
---------------

[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 944767] speechd:   Couldn't load specified
output module
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 960916] speechd:   Reading configuration for
pattern emacs:*
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 965153] speechd:   Reading configuration for
pattern *:gnomespeech:*
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 965389] speechd:  Configuration has been read
from "/usr/local/etc/speech-dispatcher//speechd.conf"
[Sun Sep  9 14:06:19 2007 : 965519] speechd: Error [speechd.c:446]:No speech
output modules were loaded - aborting...
laptop:~ #





D
arragh

Re: Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Having looked at your output, it seems that the festival server isn't
running. If you haven't done so already, you need to enable localhost
to connect to it in festival.scm. Under debian, this is in the /etc
directory, I don't recall off hand where it is in other distros. Chuck
was dealing with this very issue a few days ago.

If you still need a working copy of festival.conf, and speech.conf, I
can adjust my setup to use festival again, and send those files to
you. I however can't do this now, it will have to be in about 6-7
hours from now or so. So, if you still need them, and haven't gotten
them by that time from someone else, speak up (grin).

Greg


On Sun, Sep 09, 2007 at 04:18:20PM +0100, Darragh wrote:
> Hello again,
> 
> When I run speech-dispatcher -d I get the following output.  Any
> suggestions?
> 
> One of my problems here are that I'm using Putty from a windows box to ssh
> into my linux machine as I don't have any screen reader available there at
> the moment so I cant really go through the conf file with any degree of
> certainty that I'm on the right line.  Perhaps someone could send their
> speech.conf and festival.conf file for speech dispatcher to me?  My address
> is lists@digitaldarragh.com
> 
> I'm sorry.  I know this is probably easy enough to fix but the lack of a
> screen reader on my laptop is really causing me problems.  I'm driving my
> girl friend nuts by asking her to read the screen when something happens I
> cant look at using putty.  
> 
> Here is the output from speech-dispatcher -d
> 


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Re: Problem while getting Speech dispatcher working.

[Chuck Hallenbeck]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1


Be sure you have the package festival-freebsoft-utils installed. It is
the link that ties speech-dispatcher to festival. Then you have to
specify your localhost by one name or another as authorized to access
the festival server. Only when all that happens can speech-dispatcher
communicate with festival.

And make sure you have a directory called /var/log/speech-dispatcher in
which all your logs will be placed. Those logs are very valuable
sources of information when something goes wrong.

On Sun, Sep 09, 2007 at 10:09:43AM -0700, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Having looked at your output, it seems that the festival server isn't
> running. If you haven't done so already, you need to enable localhost
> to connect to it in festival.scm. Under debian, this is in the /etc
> directory, I don't recall off hand where it is in other distros. Chuck
> was dealing with this very issue a few days ago.
> 
> If you still need a working copy of festival.conf, and speech.conf, I
> can adjust my setup to use festival again, and send those files to
> you. I however can't do this now, it will have to be in about 6-7
> hours from now or so. So, if you still need them, and haven't gotten
> them by that time from someone else, speak up (grin).
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> On Sun, Sep 09, 2007 at 04:18:20PM +0100, Darragh wrote:
> > Hello again,
> > 
> > When I run speech-dispatcher -d I get the following output.  Any
> > suggestions?
> > 
> > One of my problems here are that I'm using Putty from a windows box to ssh
> > into my linux machine as I don't have any screen reader available there at
> > the moment so I cant really go through the conf file with any degree of
> > certainty that I'm on the right line.  Perhaps someone could send their
> > speech.conf and festival.conf file for speech dispatcher to me?  My address
> > is lists@digitaldarragh.com
> > 
> > I'm sorry.  I know this is probably easy enough to fix but the lack of a
> > screen reader on my laptop is really causing me problems.  I'm driving my
> > girl friend nuts by asking her to read the screen when something happens I
> > cant look at using putty.  
> > 
> > Here is the output from speech-dispatcher -d
> > 
> 
> 
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> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
> 
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> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> 
> iD8DBQFG5CjX7s9z/XlyUyARArT2AKDX388f3kXb7V/r7aTBbqP4hN1u4QCfQQHZ
> H/lMtaqHlzwJrEWj32LdRYo=
> =ZiJy
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

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Re: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

Excellent prices no one can beat is www. outletpc.com. site is accessible as 
well. you can even sign up for discount coupons.

Cody
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 5:35 PM
Subject: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when I 
last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is newegg
> a challenge to order from using lynx?
> Not that I am not going to try again lol.
> Karen
>
> On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
>
>> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
>> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
>> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
>> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
>> was so much as a scratch on it.
>>
>> cheers,
>> jane
>>
>> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite 
>>> for
>>> good prices and selection?
>>> Thanks,
>>> Karen
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Speakup mailing list
>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Karen Lewellen]

Hi all,
There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
good prices and selection?
Thanks,
Karen

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

New Egg is usually very good, both in terms of selection, and prices:

http://www.newegg.com

Hth.

Greg


On Mon, Sep 10, 2007 at 05:35:37PM -0400, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Katie Durden]

I got a 500gb sata drive for $119 :D I love newegg
and a 4gb thumb drive for $29

On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 14:38 -0700, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> New Egg is usually very good, both in terms of selection, and prices:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com
> 
> Hth.
> 
> Greg
> 
> 
> On Mon, Sep 10, 2007 at 05:35:37PM -0400, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> > Hi all,
> > There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> > good prices and selection?
> > Thanks,
> > Karen
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> > 
> 
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> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
> 
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> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

tigerdirect.com.
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 3:35 PM
Subject: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
was so much as a scratch on it.

cheers,
jane

On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Karen Lewellen]

Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is newegg 
a challenge to order from using lynx?
Not that I am not going to try again lol.
Karen

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:

> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
> was so much as a scratch on it.
>
> cheers,
> jane
>
> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for
>> good prices and selection?
>> Thanks,
>> Karen
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Karen Lewellen]

Oh my goodness!
I was not there long, but I will be spending some money there tonight for 
sure.

Kare

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Cody wrote:

> their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when I
> last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>
>
>> Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is newegg
>> a challenge to order from using lynx?
>> Not that I am not going to try again lol.
>> Karen
>>
>> On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
>>
>>> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
>>> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
>>> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
>>> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
>>> was so much as a scratch on it.
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>> jane
>>>
>>> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite
>>>> for
>>>> good prices and selection?
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Karen
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Speakup mailing list
>>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Speakup mailing list
>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

point being that I wouldn't use newegg even if it was accessible. I sadly 
use IE but FF under ubuntu. Outlet still has better prices..

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Katie Durden" <katielicious66@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 9:29 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Um, Newegg is perfectly accessible I've used it a dozen times and never
> once had any problem.
> It might have something to do with using lynx ...
> try firefox, or even *cough gag splutter* internet exploder...
>
> Katie
>
> On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:52 -0400, Cody wrote:
>> their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when 
>> I
>> last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
>> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
>> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
>> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>>
>>
>> > Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is 
>> > newegg
>> > a challenge to order from using lynx?
>> > Not that I am not going to try again lol.
>> > Karen
>> >
>> > On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
>> >
>> >> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
>> >> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
>> >> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
>> >> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
>> >> was so much as a scratch on it.
>> >>
>> >> cheers,
>> >> jane
>> >>
>> >> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>> >>> Hi all,
>> >>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite
>> >>> for
>> >>> good prices and selection?
>> >>> Thanks,
>> >>> Karen
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> Speakup mailing list
>> >>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Speakup mailing list
>> >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Speakup mailing list
>> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Garret Klein]

Perswonally, I use NewEgg (www.newegg.com). Unfortunately, you can't buy 
anything using a text browser, because they use some weird and exotic 
JavaScript. If you have access to a Wnidows box, you can use that, or 
gnome with orca and firefox 3.

Garrett

Karen Lewellen wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Garret Klein]

Perswonally, I use NewEgg (www.newegg.com). Unfortunately, you can't buy 
anything using a text browser, because they use some weird and exotic 
JavaScript. If you have access to a Wnidows box, you can use that, or 
gnome with orca and firefox 3.

Garrett	

Karen Lewellen wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Katie Durden]

Um, Newegg is perfectly accessible I've used it a dozen times and never
once had any problem.
It might have something to do with using lynx ...
try firefox, or even *cough gag splutter* internet exploder...

Katie

On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:52 -0400, Cody wrote:
> their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when I 
> last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
> 
> 
> > Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is newegg
> > a challenge to order from using lynx?
> > Not that I am not going to try again lol.
> > Karen
> >
> > On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
> >
> >> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
> >> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
> >> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
> >> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
> >> was so much as a scratch on it.
> >>
> >> cheers,
> >> jane
> >>
> >> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
> >>> Hi all,
> >>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite 
> >>> for
> >>> good prices and selection?
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Karen
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Speakup mailing list
> >>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >>>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Speakup mailing list
> >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Speakup mailing list
> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

I like zipzoomfly.com. Good prices and free shipping. Pretty nice
selection as well. Compare with newegg.com, which you may want to try as
well. Cheap shipping, good prices and probably the best selection.

HTH,
Lorenzo
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 17:35 -0400, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[John Heim]

Your idea of "perfectly accessible" is having to use IE?

newegg.com doesn't meet 408 standards or the WAI level 1 guidelines. It's a 
pain to use because there are a bzillion links to get past before  you get 
to the content.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Katie Durden" <katielicious66@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:29 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Um, Newegg is perfectly accessible I've used it a dozen times and never
> once had any problem.
> It might have something to do with using lynx ...
> try firefox, or even *cough gag splutter* internet exploder...
>
> Katie
>
> On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:52 -0400, Cody wrote:
>> their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when 
>> I
>> last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
>> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
>> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
>> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>>
>>
>> > Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is 
>> > newegg
>> > a challenge to order from using lynx?
>> > Not that I am not going to try again lol.
>> > Karen
>> >
>> > On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
>> >
>> >> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
>> >> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
>> >> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
>> >> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
>> >> was so much as a scratch on it.
>> >>
>> >> cheers,
>> >> jane
>> >>
>> >> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>> >>> Hi all,
>> >>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite
>> >>> for
>> >>> good prices and selection?
>> >>> Thanks,
>> >>> Karen
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> Speakup mailing list
>> >>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Speakup mailing list
>> >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Speakup mailing list
>> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Ralph W. Reid]

Online computer parts stores...so many, indeed!  I have used several
of them through the years.  Here are some I have used recently:

www.pcliquidator.com

I especially like the prices on ethernet cables at PC Liquidator.
They also sell used and/or older parts and systems.  I was not able to
complete my most recent order from this place with lynx (the cat) or
links (the chain), but I was able to get through their check out
process with elinks.

www.pacificgeek.com

Pacific Geek sells a variety of parts, systems, and other assorted
goodies.  I have been able to get through their order process with
links (the chain).

www.tigerdirect.com

Tiger Direct seems to have a huge inventory.  I do not recall which
browser I used for my last order with them (it has been a while).
They have some pretty good sales in their email list and on their web
site.  They seem to sell the whole spectrum of computer components and
other stuff--from the higher quality stuff down to the low quality
junk that should probably not be on the market.  If you have some idea
of what you are looking for, their place might be a good lace to
look.  Otherwise, just browsing around there can take a long time
because there is so much stuff to check out.

www.newegg.com

New Egg seems to have all of the latest computer components anyone
could want and more.  I recently built a computer system with mostly
parts from their site.  I like the way their menu choices really help
narrow down the available options--seems to actually be some
intelligence there.  I was forced to revert to MSIE on a Windows box
to access their site though.

www.directron.com

I recently purchased a computer case from Directron.  Their text
descriptions were good enough for me to make a good choice (unlike
some other sites which seem to let the pictures do the describing).  I
had someone else confirm the way the case looked in the pictures and
go through the check out process, so I do not know which of the
browsers I have might have worked.

There are so many sites out there to choose from.  If you do not like
one, try another--you will probably find one which suits your needs if
you look around enough.

HTH, and have a great day.

On Mon, Sep 10, 2007 at 05:35:37PM -0400, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> Hi all,
> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a favorite for 
> good prices and selection?
> Thanks,
> Karen

-- 
Ralph.  N6BNO.  Wisdom comes from central processing, not from I/O.
rreid@sunset.net  http://personalweb.sunset.net/~rreid
...passing through The City of Internet at the speed of light...
SECANT (x) = TAN (x) / COTAN (x)

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

Hell no. IE is the worst way. but using any browser is a pain with it. again 
www.outletpc.com gets the vote

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Heim" <jheim@math.wisc.edu>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 11:21 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Your idea of "perfectly accessible" is having to use IE?
>
> newegg.com doesn't meet 408 standards or the WAI level 1 guidelines. It's 
> a
> pain to use because there are a bzillion links to get past before  you get
> to the content.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Katie Durden" <katielicious66@gmail.com>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 8:29 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>
>
>> Um, Newegg is perfectly accessible I've used it a dozen times and never
>> once had any problem.
>> It might have something to do with using lynx ...
>> try firefox, or even *cough gag splutter* internet exploder...
>>
>> Katie
>>
>> On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 16:52 -0400, Cody wrote:
>>> their site seemed to be very inaccessible or at least a pain to use when
>>> I
>>> last checked. Best bet is to go with outlet pc www.outletpc.com
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
>>> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux."
>>> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
>>> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 6:58 PM
>>> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>>>
>>>
>>> > Fantastic ideas all.  I am glad I asked.  Still is it just me or is
>>> > newegg
>>> > a challenge to order from using lynx?
>>> > Not that I am not going to try again lol.
>>> > Karen
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, 10 Sep 2007, Jane Lee wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> If anything, newegg.  Not only do they have a good selection and good
>>> >> prices, but their customer support is unparalleled.  Once a package
>>> >> came opened by UPS (i guess...), I sent them a short email with a
>>> >> photo, and they flat out offered to replace it free of cost if there
>>> >> was so much as a scratch on it.
>>> >>
>>> >> cheers,
>>> >> jane
>>> >>
>>> >> On 9/10/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>>> >>> Hi all,
>>> >>> There are so many these days, I am wondering if folks have a 
>>> >>> favorite
>>> >>> for
>>> >>> good prices and selection?
>>> >>> Thanks,
>>> >>> Karen
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> _______________________________________________
>>> >>> Speakup mailing list
>>> >>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> >>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Speakup mailing list
>>> >> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> >> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Speakup mailing list
>>> > Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> > http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Speakup mailing list
>>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.14/999 - Release Date: 9/10/2007 
> 5:43 PM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

It may not meet standards, nor might it be usable in links or what
have you, but if you're willing to go through some of the cruft,
newegg is not an online retailer to be ignored.  Not I'm not saying
it's perfectly accessible, just that you shouldn't just throw it out
if you can deal with it.

Cody: Compared to newegg, outletpc is practically a joke in terms of
selection from what I've looked at so far.  Some..wait, make that
most, manufacturers, e.g. for motherboards, are completely missing.  I
think newegg has more socket am2 motherboards than all of outletpc's
mobo selection combined.  Also not available are nice discounts for
combos.  Even on the hardware outletpc has that newegg also has the
prices aren't that comparable.

Newegg also has the fantastic option that not many have to seriously
narrow down exactly what you want - e.g. go from Motherboard to AMD
compatible to socket AM2 to sort by manufacturer/price..free shipping
or not, bestsellers, and so on.

If you're willing to spend the time and use the software that'll make
your newegg experience least painful, it's worth it.  And if you like
it enough, you should complain to them about it:
http://www.newegg.com/Info/ContactUs.aspx

for what it's worth, I don't work for newegg.  I also like some other
retailers like zipzoomfly and (used to like) tiger direct.  However, I
don't get the newegg bashing, cause other than the slight
inaccessibility (please don't flame me for this, it's completely
subjective) it's a fantastic place.  In fact even if it were more
expensive than some of its competitors I'd still go here, because
their products get shipped to me fast because i live near one of their
warehouses, and also because their customer support, like I have said,
is amazing.

cheers,
jane

On 9/11/07, John Heim <jheim@math.wisc.edu> wrote:
> Your idea of "perfectly accessible" is having to use IE?
>
> newegg.com doesn't meet 408 standards or the WAI level 1 guidelines. It's a
> pain to use because there are a bzillion links to get past before  you get
> to the content.

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[John Heim]

Well, you're right about that. Newegg is definately the industry standard 
for low prices and wide selection. I just ordered from them Monday night. Or 
I should say my wife placed an order for me. I think we can all agree that 
newegg is awesome in terms of price and selection but I would not give them 
high marks for accessibility.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jane Lee" <applegoddess@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 5:44 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> It may not meet standards, nor might it be usable in links or what
> have you, but if you're willing to go through some of the cruft,
> newegg is not an online retailer to be ignored.  Not I'm not saying
> it's perfectly accessible, just that you shouldn't just throw it out
> if you can deal with it.
>
> Cody: Compared to newegg, outletpc is practically a joke in terms of
> selection from what I've looked at so far.  Some..wait, make that
> most, manufacturers, e.g. for motherboards, are completely missing.  I
> think newegg has more socket am2 motherboards than all of outletpc's
> mobo selection combined.  Also not available are nice discounts for
> combos.  Even on the hardware outletpc has that newegg also has the
> prices aren't that comparable.
>
> Newegg also has the fantastic option that not many have to seriously
> narrow down exactly what you want - e.g. go from Motherboard to AMD
> compatible to socket AM2 to sort by manufacturer/price..free shipping
> or not, bestsellers, and so on.
>
> If you're willing to spend the time and use the software that'll make
> your newegg experience least painful, it's worth it.  And if you like
> it enough, you should complain to them about it:
> http://www.newegg.com/Info/ContactUs.aspx
>
> for what it's worth, I don't work for newegg.  I also like some other
> retailers like zipzoomfly and (used to like) tiger direct.  However, I
> don't get the newegg bashing, cause other than the slight
> inaccessibility (please don't flame me for this, it's completely
> subjective) it's a fantastic place.  In fact even if it were more
> expensive than some of its competitors I'd still go here, because
> their products get shipped to me fast because i live near one of their
> warehouses, and also because their customer support, like I have said,
> is amazing.
>
> cheers,
> jane
>
> On 9/11/07, John Heim <jheim@math.wisc.edu> wrote:
>> Your idea of "perfectly accessible" is having to use IE?
>>
>> newegg.com doesn't meet 408 standards or the WAI level 1 guidelines. It's 
>> a
>> pain to use because there are a bzillion links to get past before  you 
>> get
>> to the content.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Smith]

 do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.  What I do
 if I need something is just to go to Circuit City or Radio Shack and
 pick it up.  If you have transportation, this is definitely the best
 way to go.  
 
 
 
 -- 
Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
Computer Scientist For CHRIST

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Karen Lewellen]

I can respect this wisdom...unless you are  in need of older parts etc.
What I prefer, and what I wish newegg did for its customers who cannot 
shop online is to choose what I desire, and order over the phone.  Jury 
still out over there as to the site.
outlets-PC beat them on most everything, but not all I needed is there.
Thanks for such an interesting thread,
Karen

On Wed, 12 Sep 2007, Doug Smith wrote:

>
> do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.  What I do
> if I need something is just to go to Circuit City or Radio Shack and
> pick it up.  If you have transportation, this is definitely the best
> way to go.
>
>
>
> --
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[John Heim]

From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 11:25 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>
> do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.

Why not? Security?

>What I do
> if I need something is just to go to Circuit City or Radio Shack and
> pick it up.  If you have transportation, this is definitely the best
> way to go.

It depends on what you want. Are you going to buy a motherboard at CC?  How 
are you going to pick the one with the right features? Are you counting on 
help from a salesperson or a friend? What if they don't have one with the 
right features? And you know you'll  pay a lot more for it at CC than you 
would at newegg.

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, Sep 12, 2007 at 03:44:31AM -0700, Jane Lee wrote:
> Cody: Compared to newegg, outletpc is practically a joke in terms of
> selection from what I've looked at so far.

A friend of mine agrees with that assessment completely. His mb died
recently, so he's building a new system in terms of mb, ram, cpu, and
video card, since he says mb makers are doing away with agp slots, in
favor of pcie, thanks to vista supposedly. Since he's still shopping
around, I've been forwarding to him all the web sites mentioned in
this thread. He pretty much told me the same thing as Jane said now,
outletpc sucks in terms of selection, when compared to newegg. For
example, he's looking for a mb that supports sli, since he's into
graphics, video editing, gaming, and all that kind of stuff, (no, he's
not fully sighted, but he doesn't need magnification, or a screen
reader either). He claims that outletpc has no sli mb's, nor for that
matter, mb's with features that advanced pc users would want, and
expect to have on an mb. 

Also, I think he mentioned as well that the cpu he's planning to get,
is $220 on newegg, and is $269 on outletpc.
Greg


- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

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Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)

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yH3RFMlJlXP9SdclAP1yXy8=
=04Fr
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

That's an option, but the down-side to that is that these kinds of
stores don't have a selection as good as the online stores do, and
their prices usually are also more than the online store prices, even
if you take shipping into account.

Greg


On Wed, Sep 12, 2007 at 12:25:34PM -0400, Doug Smith wrote:
> 
>  do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.  What I do
>  if I need something is just to go to Circuit City or Radio Shack and
>  pick it up.  If you have transportation, this is definitely the best
>  way to go.  
>  
>  
>  
>  -- 
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

- --
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)

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acaFeJeHTvMbP0uscQ+aaL4=
=UTo1
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

I actually used newegg with lynx, but that was several years ago. I
sincerely hope that they haven't changed things so much that this has
become impossible now. They have a very good selection and decent prices
as well as cheap shipping. But if they have messed things up so that
people using links (chain) or lynx (cat) are unable to access it, they
will obviously lose a lot of us. Probably not me if they work with
firefox 3, but they will lose most of us here. Has anyone tried emailing
them to complain about the usability of their site and to suggest
possible changes for better accessibility? I would be interested in
knowing what their response would be.

Live long and prosper,
Lorenzo

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

Considering what has been said of Newegg's customer support, I would be
willing to bet that a blind person who uses lynx (cat) or links (chain)
would probably go far making suggestions regarding accessibility. I use
ff3 here and have had no problems, although I haven't actually tried to
order anything. But those of you who use lynx and links should try
contacting them to suggest how the site could be made more accessible.
And those of us who use ff3, if there are problems, should report them
as well. If their customer support is really as good as people say it
is, they will listen to our suggestions. Note that a simple complaint
like "I can't use your site with lynx" probably won't work.
*suggestions* should be made regarding how the site can be made more
accessible to text browsers and screen readers.

Live long and prosper,
Lorenzo

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

Here where I live there is a place called Intrex. They serve most all my
needs with great prices. However, it's a local shop with only about 7
locations and those are all in one state. If you happen to live in North
Carolina in the Triad or Triangle area, it is about the best shop around
for selection and pricing, not to mention the fact that you don't have
to pay for shipping and wait, since it is local. On the other hand, I
have found nothing else like Intrex anywhere else, maybe someone who
lives in another area could give local suggestions. If there isn't a
good local store, the only way to get a good selection and a good price
is by shopping online. The chain stores, for some reason, seem to have
higher prices, although their selection is generally good. Just an
example, I bought a crossover network cable from Best Buy and paid $22.
Later I bought another crossover network cable of the same length from
Intrex and paid $8. I found the same price gap for USB cables, both at
Best Buy and Circuit City as well as at a couple of office supply
stores. The prices at those stores were around $20 for an 8 foot cable,
but at Intrex the price is $7, and if memory serves, that is the price
for a 10 foot cable. The only other places where I have found prices on
the same level have been Newegg and ZipZoomFly. But both require ff3. I
can browse the sites using lynd and links, but I can't order anything
without using ff3.

Live long and prosper,
Lorenzo

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Well, since we're into local stores, there is krex computers in Morton
Grove Illinois, which is northern suburbs of Chicago:

http://www.krex.com

They sell locally, as well as being an online store, and as far as I
know, you pay the same price when you pick stuff up directly, as you
do when buying online, the difference being shipping costs of
course. They were very good when I built my first pc with all parts
from them about 7 years ago, but they've dropped in competitiveness
since than in terms of pricing.

There is also frys electronics:

http://www.outpost.com

or

http://www.frys.com

which is a chain of stores in the western U.S., though I believe they
have the most locations in Arizona, as opposed to other states. They
are an online store as well. Their prices are good, and their
selection isn't bad either. However, they are good if you're only
upgrading a pc, if you're building one from scratch, then you won't be
able to buy all the parts you need for that at frys. Also, the
prices, and selection in some cases, differ between the retail stores,
and the online store.

Greg


On Wed, Sep 12, 2007 at 03:02:10PM -0400, Lorenzo Taylor wrote:
> Here where I live there is a place called Intrex. They serve most all my
> needs with great prices. However, it's a local shop with only about 7
> locations and those are all in one state. If you happen to live in North
> Carolina in the Triad or Triangle area, it is about the best shop around
> for selection and pricing, not to mention the fact that you don't have
> to pay for shipping and wait, since it is local. On the other hand, I
> have found nothing else like Intrex anywhere else, maybe someone who
> lives in another area could give local suggestions. If there isn't a
> good local store, the only way to get a good selection and a good price
> is by shopping online. The chain stores, for some reason, seem to have
> higher prices, although their selection is generally good. Just an
> example, I bought a crossover network cable from Best Buy and paid $22.
> Later I bought another crossover network cable of the same length from
> Intrex and paid $8. I found the same price gap for USB cables, both at
> Best Buy and Circuit City as well as at a couple of office supply
> stores. The prices at those stores were around $20 for an 8 foot cable,
> but at Intrex the price is $7, and if memory serves, that is the price
> for a 10 foot cable. The only other places where I have found prices on
> the same level have been Newegg and ZipZoomFly. But both require ff3. I
> can browse the sites using lynd and links, but I can't order anything
> without using ff3.
> 
> Live long and prosper,
> Lorenzo
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
> 

- -- 
web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
skype: gregn1
(authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)

- --
Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
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pJk4+Yb+8XT51Q/peh/hEgE=
=khlG
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Luke Yelavich]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 05:26:34AM EST, Gregory Nowak wrote:
> Well, since we're into local stores,

Being from Australia, I prefer to shop locally. I always buy online, from a Sydney based shop called SecretNet, 
http://www.secret.com.au/computers. Their site is accessible in all browsers, whether it be GUI or text mode, and their 
prices are great. They also have one of the best selections of parts as well, and have an online system builder, to 
allow you to select parts for a box, depending on how well you know computer gear, and what your budget is. They will 
then build the machine for you, at no extra cost, if I recall.

Australia also has a site that allows you to find the best price for any component in Australia, but I'd rather support 
a local business who have great support and service, and great prices.
- -- 
Luke Yelavich
GPG key: 0xD06320CE 
	 (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt)
Email & MSN: themuso@themuso.com
Jabber: themuso@jabber.org.au
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vLJcPM0FRgraGHJPS30uigQ=
=avhw
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

On 9/12/07, Doug Smith <dougsmith1@charter.net> wrote:
>  do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.

Doug - shopping online is perfectly fine.  I have a Fry's nearby me,
and that's the only retailer that has more than like, 3 motherboards
(if at all) available, and even then their selection isn't that great
compared to what I can find online.  That's just the selection,
nevermind the pricing.  Plus ordering online is cheaper, even with
shipping factored in (and you don't count the gas it takes to drive to
a place that might have what you want).

On 9/12/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
> What I prefer, and what I wish newegg did for its customers who cannot
> shop online is to choose what I desire, and order over the phone.

Karen - newegg doesn't even do email orders, unfortunately.  They
never have..it's all online.  There's certainly a phone number to call
for support though, maybe you can go yell at them, smile.

On 9/12/07, Gregory Nowak <greg@romuald.net.eu.org> wrote:
> He claims that outletpc has no sli mb's, nor for that
> matter, mb's with features that advanced pc users would want, and
> expect to have on an mb.

Yeah, I noted that too.  And even if there were, it was difficult to
find because it wasn't organized well, nor do they have the same tools
newegg gives you to narrow down the selection.  Plus they don't have
DFI motherboards, and those are my absolute favorite.

On 9/12/07, Lorenzo Taylor <daxlinux@gmail.com> wrote:
> I actually used newegg with lynx, but that was several years ago. I
> sincerely hope that they haven't changed things so much that this has
> become impossible now.

Newegg actually did a complete overhaul of their site like, a year ago
or so.  It's a lot messier now.  I'm sighted, but even I have a hard
time trying to navigate the pages sometimes because the menus are
mucked up CSS...and the pages take forever to load because there's so
much cruft.  Nevermind that my primary browser is Safari for Mac, and
when the new site was in beta some things just absolutely didn't work
at all in that browser.

On 9/12/07, Gregory Nowak <greg@romuald.net.eu.org> wrote:
> There is also frys electronics:
> which is a chain of stores in the western U.S., though I believe they
> have the most locations in Arizona, as opposed to other states.

Fry's isn't bad, but I think they have the largest number of stores in
California, not Arizona...their salespeople are awful and sort of
sexist (I haven't had good experiences with asking them to find a
product I couldn't find..ends up with "are you sure you want that?  is
that compatible with what you're doing?" every other minute..what, do
women not shop for hard drives and motherboards?!) but their selection
in-store is passable and definitely better than retailers like circuit
city or best buy.  But I digress...five or six years ago, I built a
computer all out of parts from Fry's.  Worked great.  It's being used
as a headless server now.

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

doug, go wikipedia ssl.

Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jane Lee" <applegoddess@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 6:13 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> On 9/12/07, Doug Smith <dougsmith1@charter.net> wrote:
>>  do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.
> 
> Doug - shopping online is perfectly fine.  I have a Fry's nearby me,
> and that's the only retailer that has more than like, 3 motherboards
> (if at all) available, and even then their selection isn't that great
> compared to what I can find online.  That's just the selection,
> nevermind the pricing.  Plus ordering online is cheaper, even with
> shipping factored in (and you don't count the gas it takes to drive to
> a place that might have what you want).
> 
> On 9/12/07, Karen Lewellen <klewellen@shellworld.net> wrote:
>> What I prefer, and what I wish newegg did for its customers who cannot
>> shop online is to choose what I desire, and order over the phone.
> 
> Karen - newegg doesn't even do email orders, unfortunately.  They
> never have..it's all online.  There's certainly a phone number to call
> for support though, maybe you can go yell at them, smile.
> 
> On 9/12/07, Gregory Nowak <greg@romuald.net.eu.org> wrote:
>> He claims that outletpc has no sli mb's, nor for that
>> matter, mb's with features that advanced pc users would want, and
>> expect to have on an mb.
> 
> Yeah, I noted that too.  And even if there were, it was difficult to
> find because it wasn't organized well, nor do they have the same tools
> newegg gives you to narrow down the selection.  Plus they don't have
> DFI motherboards, and those are my absolute favorite.
> 
> On 9/12/07, Lorenzo Taylor <daxlinux@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I actually used newegg with lynx, but that was several years ago. I
>> sincerely hope that they haven't changed things so much that this has
>> become impossible now.
> 
> Newegg actually did a complete overhaul of their site like, a year ago
> or so.  It's a lot messier now.  I'm sighted, but even I have a hard
> time trying to navigate the pages sometimes because the menus are
> mucked up CSS...and the pages take forever to load because there's so
> much cruft.  Nevermind that my primary browser is Safari for Mac, and
> when the new site was in beta some things just absolutely didn't work
> at all in that browser.
> 
> On 9/12/07, Gregory Nowak <greg@romuald.net.eu.org> wrote:
>> There is also frys electronics:
>> which is a chain of stores in the western U.S., though I believe they
>> have the most locations in Arizona, as opposed to other states.
> 
> Fry's isn't bad, but I think they have the largest number of stores in
> California, not Arizona...their salespeople are awful and sort of
> sexist (I haven't had good experiences with asking them to find a
> product I couldn't find..ends up with "are you sure you want that?  is
> that compatible with what you're doing?" every other minute..what, do
> women not shop for hard drives and motherboards?!) but their selection
> in-store is passable and definitely better than retailers like circuit
> city or best buy.  But I digress...five or six years ago, I built a
> computer all out of parts from Fry's.  Worked great.  It's being used
> as a headless server now.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Glenn Ervin]

Has anyone mentioned:
http://www.buy.com/
I have had good luck with this company.
Glenn

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karen Lewellen" <klewellen@shellworld.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


I can respect this wisdom...unless you are  in need of older parts etc.
What I prefer, and what I wish newegg did for its customers who cannot 
shop online is to choose what I desire, and order over the phone.  Jury 
still out over there as to the site.
outlets-PC beat them on most everything, but not all I needed is there.
Thanks for such an interesting thread,
Karen

On Wed, 12 Sep 2007, Doug Smith wrote:

>
> do not shop on line, and I don't recommend it to anyone.  What I do
> if I need something is just to go to Circuit City or Radio Shack and
> pick it up.  If you have transportation, this is definitely the best
> way to go.
>
>
>
> --
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>

_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Smith]

I have never had a problem with Radio Shack or Circuit City.  The
people at Circuit City are very nice to me and go over all the
features of anything I might need.  They know that I am sure about
what I am doing and how to do it before I leave the store.  

I know some of you get some parts like mother boards and whatever.  I
do not know how to put a machine together, so such things as these are
not the kinds of parts I go and get.  I usually need a new drive, some
ram or maybe, occasionally, a sound card.  

Even the people at Radio Shack know me and make sure that I have
whatever I might need and know how to use it before I leave the store.
I have never had any problems ordering the few things I have needed to
order.  They will even order them for me directly from their online
catalog right there in the store and tell me when to come back.  

It is just better to leave the store with the item(s) in hand so that
I can get back here and do whatever it  might be that needs doing
and get back to enjoying using my machine.  





-- 
Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
Computer Scientist For CHRIST

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Smith]

How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
upgrade one without sighted help?  I was always told never to mess
inside mine without sighted help, or, better, yet, let someone who can
see do it for me.  This is what I have always done.  How can I learn
to build and upgrade a computer without sighted assistance? 



Thanks. 




-- 
Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
Computer Scientist For CHRIST

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

I learned through getting old machines and taking them apart, and googling 
for what things were. I've built my own machines and being told that sighted 
help is required is nonsense. A totally blind person can do anything a 
sighted person can. There are some things you'll need to get acquainted with 
however like the shape and feel of different processors, pci/isa cards, 
different ram etc. but it can be done and I enjoy building and upgrading 
machines. The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the small 
wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights and 
the power button. but the only way you will ever know your machine is to 
explore it yourself. Most of the stuff will explain itself, but it can be 
fun.

Have fun,
Cody

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 5:59 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
> upgrade one without sighted help?  I was always told never to mess
> inside mine without sighted help, or, better, yet, let someone who can
> see do it for me.  This is what I have always done.  How can I learn
> to build and upgrade a computer without sighted assistance?
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

I live in a tiney town.
I don't have a circket city, and radio shack is just a catalog.
Sometimes online is the only way.
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>I have never had a problem with Radio Shack or Circuit City.  The
> people at Circuit City are very nice to me and go over all the
> features of anything I might need.  They know that I am sure about
> what I am doing and how to do it before I leave the store.  
> 
> I know some of you get some parts like mother boards and whatever.  I
> do not know how to put a machine together, so such things as these are
> not the kinds of parts I go and get.  I usually need a new drive, some
> ram or maybe, occasionally, a sound card.  
> 
> Even the people at Radio Shack know me and make sure that I have
> whatever I might need and know how to use it before I leave the store.
> I have never had any problems ordering the few things I have needed to
> order.  They will even order them for me directly from their online
> catalog right there in the store and tell me when to come back.  
> 
> It is just better to leave the store with the item(s) in hand so that
> I can get back here and do whatever it  might be that needs doing
> and get back to enjoying using my machine.  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

its not to hard to do that.. I had to do it once when I pulled the power 
cord out on accident. :)
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cody" <churst35@verizon.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>I learned through getting old machines and taking them apart, and googling
> for what things were. I've built my own machines and being told that 
> sighted
> help is required is nonsense. A totally blind person can do anything a
> sighted person can. There are some things you'll need to get acquainted 
> with
> however like the shape and feel of different processors, pci/isa cards,
> different ram etc. but it can be done and I enjoy building and upgrading
> machines. The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the 
> small
> wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights 
> and
> the power button. but the only way you will ever know your machine is to
> explore it yourself. Most of the stuff will explain itself, but it can be
> fun.
>
> Have fun,
> Cody
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 5:59 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>
>
>> How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
>> upgrade one without sighted help?  I was always told never to mess
>> inside mine without sighted help, or, better, yet, let someone who can
>> see do it for me.  This is what I have always done.  How can I learn
>> to build and upgrade a computer without sighted assistance?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
>> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date:
>> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

For all of your information, I just purchased a mini wireless finder from 
outlet pc for $13. Try beating that price anywhere else like best buys or 
newegg. I looked at some of the so called specials at newegg and they were 
not specials. Very pricy.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Littlefield, Tyler" <compgeek13@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>I live in a tiney town.
> I don't have a circket city, and radio shack is just a catalog.
> Sometimes online is the only way.
> Thanks,
> Tyler Littlefield.
> Vertigo head coder
> "My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
> msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
> email: compgeek13@gmail.com
> aim: st8amnd2005
> skype: st8amnd127
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 3:55 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>
>
>>I have never had a problem with Radio Shack or Circuit City.  The
>> people at Circuit City are very nice to me and go over all the
>> features of anything I might need.  They know that I am sure about
>> what I am doing and how to do it before I leave the store.
>>
>> I know some of you get some parts like mother boards and whatever.  I
>> do not know how to put a machine together, so such things as these are
>> not the kinds of parts I go and get.  I usually need a new drive, some
>> ram or maybe, occasionally, a sound card.
>>
>> Even the people at Radio Shack know me and make sure that I have
>> whatever I might need and know how to use it before I leave the store.
>> I have never had any problems ordering the few things I have needed to
>> order.  They will even order them for me directly from their online
>> catalog right there in the store and tell me when to come back.
>>
>> It is just better to leave the store with the item(s) in hand so that
>> I can get back here and do whatever it  might be that needs doing
>> and get back to enjoying using my machine.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
>> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Luke Yelavich]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 07:59:00AM EST, Doug Smith wrote:
> How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
> upgrade one without sighted help?

- From talking to people, and experimenting on an older box we had. I can do everything, except mounting a CPU 
heatsync/fan, the trickiest part of that being applying the thermal compound. Otherwise, everything else is 
not too difficult, although at times, it can be time consuming.
- -- 
Luke Yelavich
GPG key: 0xD06320CE 
	 (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt)
Email & MSN: themuso@themuso.com
Jabber: themuso@jabber.org.au
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)

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W4doSNZAjOkMIBIauwf7dhc=
=wcaD
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 06:38:34PM -0400, Cody wrote:
> The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the small 
> wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights and 
> the power button. 

Well, there are a couple more things you'll need sighted help
for. First, as was mentioned, applying cpu compound, and installing
the heat sink. These days, since the bios screens are gui-based,
you'll need sighted help with configuring the bios as well. This used
to not be the case back in the days of text-based bios menus, and
machines with parallel ports, provided you had a way of speaking text
sent out the parallel port, a braille blazer being one example of one
such device.

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

also the jumpers vary from board to board. If you want to overclock, or 
anything like that... it's sighted help... again.
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 5:56 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 06:38:34PM -0400, Cody wrote:
>> The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the small
>> wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights 
>> and
>> the power button.
>
> Well, there are a couple more things you'll need sighted help
> for. First, as was mentioned, applying cpu compound, and installing
> the heat sink. These days, since the bios screens are gui-based,
> you'll need sighted help with configuring the bios as well. This used
> to not be the case back in the days of text-based bios menus, and
> machines with parallel ports, provided you had a way of speaking text
> sent out the parallel port, a braille blazer being one example of one
> such device.
>
> Greg
>
>
> - -- 
> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
>
> - --
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFG6c5I7s9z/XlyUyARArNzAKDWIGFmLcsaqSpXs7xJY6b+TR+I2ACfehq0
> fcNWSCU0HH7K2vJP52jz9QU=
> =zrGu
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> Speakup mailing list
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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 06:24:07PM -0600, Littlefield, Tyler wrote:
> also the jumpers vary from board to board. If you want to overclock, or 
> anything like that... it's sighted help... again.

That's mostly in the past now. These days, you typically have a jumper
for clearing cmos, and maybe 1-2 more for setting some other
things. However, cpu speed and such are set in the bios menus these
days, and there are a few boards that auto-detect the cpu settings, so
you can't over-clock on those even if you wanted to, which I
personally don't recommend doing for a couple of reasons anyway.

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

I'm aware of the paralel port and the bios situation but normally I don't 
mess with those things.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 06:38:34PM -0400, Cody wrote:
>> The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the small
>> wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights 
>> and
>> the power button.
>
> Well, there are a couple more things you'll need sighted help
> for. First, as was mentioned, applying cpu compound, and installing
> the heat sink. These days, since the bios screens are gui-based,
> you'll need sighted help with configuring the bios as well. This used
> to not be the case back in the days of text-based bios menus, and
> machines with parallel ports, provided you had a way of speaking text
> sent out the parallel port, a braille blazer being one example of one
> such device.
>
> Greg
>
>
> - -- 
> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
>
> - --
> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFG6c5I7s9z/XlyUyARArNzAKDWIGFmLcsaqSpXs7xJY6b+TR+I2ACfehq0
> fcNWSCU0HH7K2vJP52jz9QU=
> =zrGu
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
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> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the 
processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it 
down

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Luke Yelavich" <themuso@themuso.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 7:49 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 07:59:00AM EST, Doug Smith wrote:
>> How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
>> upgrade one without sighted help?
>
> - From talking to people, and experimenting on an older box we had. I can 
> do everything, except mounting a CPU
> heatsync/fan, the trickiest part of that being applying the thermal 
> compound. Otherwise, everything else is
> not too difficult, although at times, it can be time consuming.
> - -- 
> Luke Yelavich
> GPG key: 0xD06320CE
> (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt)
> Email & MSN: themuso@themuso.com
> Jabber: themuso@jabber.org.au
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> W4doSNZAjOkMIBIauwf7dhc=
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> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
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> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Luke Yelavich]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 10:54:26AM EST, Cody wrote:
> mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the 
> processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it 
> down

You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the type of CPU you are installing, 
otherwise heat issues can arrise.
- -- 
Luke Yelavich
GPG key: 0xD06320CE 
	 (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt)
Email & MSN: themuso@themuso.com
Jabber: themuso@jabber.org.au
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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

this should be possible... you can use a sheet of foil or something to press 
it down and evenly spread. if you use foil, then a block. As long as the 
glue won't seap over the edges, this might work. Just a suggestion...
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Luke Yelavich" <themuso@themuso.com>
To: <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 7:37 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 10:54:26AM EST, Cody wrote:
>> mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the
>> processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it
>> down
>
> You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the type 
> of CPU you are installing,
> otherwise heat issues can arrise.
> - -- 
> Luke Yelavich
> GPG key: 0xD06320CE
> (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt)
> Email & MSN: themuso@themuso.com
> Jabber: themuso@jabber.org.au
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFG6eXDjVefwtBjIM4RArovAJ9f6RbQUC8JspzSq4WDN1p6DzW3/wCcCXW8
> 4gpepITcKB1GKBzhlFNSdj8=
> =6uCD
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

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Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 11:37:07AM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote:
> You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the type of CPU you are installing, 
> otherwise heat issues can arrise.

Also, I've been told that you definitely don't want to get even a bit
of the stuff on the mb components around the socket. When it
comes to actually applying compound to the cpu, supposedly you don't
want to go touching the freshly applied compound, because of skin
oils. So, going back to evenly spreading it, it would be very
difficult, if not impossible to do that, without feeling around.

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> For all of your information, I just purchased a mini wireless finder from
> outlet pc for $13. Try beating that price anywhere else like best buys or
> newegg. I looked at some of the so called specials at newegg and they were
> not specials. Very pricy.

I have no idea what you're looking at, but for the vast majority of
components newegg has a huge selection of products from reputable and
generic manufacturers and their prices on said products range from
average to really low specials.  And to be honest, whether or not it
was actually a deal would depend on the product and what it can do.
>From what you've said, I don't know if I should call that a bargain or
not, but you couldn't compare two products that functionally are the
same but have differing specs.  And for what it's worth, I will stress
that except for the rare product, cheaper is not better.  I've fried
and broken many components that way, and it ended up costing me more
as I bought the more expensive better-built product when the cheaper
one broke...and since then those computers haven't failed (except for
uncontrollable circumstances, that is).

Just look at the motherboards.  Maybe you don't purchase them, but
other people do.  OutletPC is a JOKE.  I can't stress that enough.
Their selection is comprised of mostly cheaper lower end older
products, and not even many of those.  Want a great example of how
much of a ripoff it can be?  Their best LGA775 mobo is this gigabyte
one that's priced at $130 (http://www.outletpc.com/c3583.html), while
Newegg has the same one at $82
(http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128017R).
That is a price difference of $52, my friend.  Enough to buy an entire
1 gigabyte more of RAM, or to buy another DVD burner - 18x SATA, if
you wanted.  OutletPC doesn't even have the better cousin of that
motherboard that Newegg does
(http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128012).
And outletpc also doesn't have higher-up models from that Gigabyte
one, whatsoever.

On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the
> processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it
> down

It's pretty important that there be an even layer of thermal paste on
top before mounting the heat sink.  However, there are some processors
that come with heatsinks that come with a sticker of sorts instead,
it's like a thin layer of thermal compound that eventually melts
properly after the computer's been in use, and it's preapplied to the
heatsink and you only have to take off the protective plastic...that
may be an option for you.

Haphazardly applying paste is not the smartest way to go about things.
 Although it might sound simpler to apply way more than you need and
just smoosh the heatsink down, that will indeed cause heating issues -
to the point that you might just destroy the overheating processor
because the heatsink isn't dissipating the heat correctly because of
the misapplication of paste.  What you want is a very thin evenly
spread layer.  Best to follow the directions (manufacturers often have
a certain "method" or so they recommend to minimize the chance of
bubbles and imperfections), and to use good thermal paste as well.

cheers,
jane

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

Sigh, my math is sucking tonight.  It's $48 difference, before
shipping (which varies).  That's still enough to buy 1gb ram or a new
dvd burner.  Take your pick.  I'd rather go through the hassle of
ordering from newegg than being ripped off by almost $50.

cheers,
jane

On 9/13/07, Jane Lee <applegoddess@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> > For all of your information, I just purchased a mini wireless finder from
> > outlet pc for $13. Try beating that price anywhere else like best buys or
> > newegg. I looked at some of the so called specials at newegg and they were
> > not specials. Very pricy.
>
> I have no idea what you're looking at, but for the vast majority of
> components newegg has a huge selection of products from reputable and
> generic manufacturers and their prices on said products range from
> average to really low specials.  And to be honest, whether or not it
> was actually a deal would depend on the product and what it can do.
> From what you've said, I don't know if I should call that a bargain or
> not, but you couldn't compare two products that functionally are the
> same but have differing specs.  And for what it's worth, I will stress
> that except for the rare product, cheaper is not better.  I've fried
> and broken many components that way, and it ended up costing me more
> as I bought the more expensive better-built product when the cheaper
> one broke...and since then those computers haven't failed (except for
> uncontrollable circumstances, that is).
>
> Just look at the motherboards.  Maybe you don't purchase them, but
> other people do.  OutletPC is a JOKE.  I can't stress that enough.
> Their selection is comprised of mostly cheaper lower end older
> products, and not even many of those.  Want a great example of how
> much of a ripoff it can be?  Their best LGA775 mobo is this gigabyte
> one that's priced at $130 (http://www.outletpc.com/c3583.html), while
> Newegg has the same one at $82
> (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128017R).
> That is a price difference of $52, my friend.  Enough to buy an entire
> 1 gigabyte more of RAM, or to buy another DVD burner - 18x SATA, if
> you wanted.  OutletPC doesn't even have the better cousin of that
> motherboard that Newegg does
> (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128012).
> And outletpc also doesn't have higher-up models from that Gigabyte
> one, whatsoever.
>
> On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> > mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the
> > processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it
> > down
>
> It's pretty important that there be an even layer of thermal paste on
> top before mounting the heat sink.  However, there are some processors
> that come with heatsinks that come with a sticker of sorts instead,
> it's like a thin layer of thermal compound that eventually melts
> properly after the computer's been in use, and it's preapplied to the
> heatsink and you only have to take off the protective plastic...that
> may be an option for you.
>
> Haphazardly applying paste is not the smartest way to go about things.
>  Although it might sound simpler to apply way more than you need and
> just smoosh the heatsink down, that will indeed cause heating issues -
> to the point that you might just destroy the overheating processor
> because the heatsink isn't dissipating the heat correctly because of
> the misapplication of paste.  What you want is a very thin evenly
> spread layer.  Best to follow the directions (manufacturers often have
> a certain "method" or so they recommend to minimize the chance of
> bubbles and imperfections), and to use good thermal paste as well.
>
> cheers,
> jane
>

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Glenn Ervin]

Hi Doug,
Sounds like you are a victim of the sighted having a poor view of the 
capabilities of the Blind, as so many of us are, only it was aimed at your 
interests in computers, others it is in other areas, as you know.
Anyway, I have always had mechanical & electronic interests, which makes it 
fairly easy for me.
But if you get an old computer, just feel for the screws and open it up, and 
feel around, and figure out what everything is.
It is best if you can do this without a sighted person around, as they will 
try to put your hands on this and that and tell you what they are, and if 
you can avoid that, you will learn much more.
If you are interested, and have any mechanical aptitude, you will be able to 
figure out what everything is.
I am always amazed at how sighted people who are not that knowledgeable of 
computers will make labels for the cables in the back.
I tell them that there is only one place each wire can go, and if it fits 
another place, then it does not matter, except for the PS2 ports, where on 
some computers, it did matter which plug the keyboard went into versus the 
mouse plug, but if you got it wrong, it was not the end of the world.
I remember a friend was watching me work on a computer, and he said that I 
should use a grounding strap, and I said "Why?", my arm is always on the 
frame anyway.
Maybe sighted folks hold their arms in the air while working on a computer, 
but I'll bet we all steady our hands by resting our arm on the body of the 
computer.
But, if you know what you are looking for inside a computer, you should be 
able to find it by feeling around.
The only time I have ever needed sighted assistance is if I need to plug in 
a wire on the mother board, or set a jumper, and those use print markings.
Hope you will have the confidence to go for it.
Glenn

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
upgrade one without sighted help?  I was always told never to mess
inside mine without sighted help, or, better, yet, let someone who can
see do it for me.  This is what I have always done.  How can I learn
to build and upgrade a computer without sighted assistance?



Thanks.




-- 
Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
Computer Scientist For CHRIST


_______________________________________________
Speakup mailing list
Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

Forgot to mention i went to the memory section and I am not in any way 
paying over $200 for a ddr2 800 stick of ram when I can get it elsewhere for 
$35 or $50. That is pricy. Saw nothing below $90 for the type of ram I 
needed.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jane Lee" <applegoddess@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 11:16 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
>> For all of your information, I just purchased a mini wireless finder from
>> outlet pc for $13. Try beating that price anywhere else like best buys or
>> newegg. I looked at some of the so called specials at newegg and they 
>> were
>> not specials. Very pricy.
>
> I have no idea what you're looking at, but for the vast majority of
> components newegg has a huge selection of products from reputable and
> generic manufacturers and their prices on said products range from
> average to really low specials.  And to be honest, whether or not it
> was actually a deal would depend on the product and what it can do.
> From what you've said, I don't know if I should call that a bargain or
> not, but you couldn't compare two products that functionally are the
> same but have differing specs.  And for what it's worth, I will stress
> that except for the rare product, cheaper is not better.  I've fried
> and broken many components that way, and it ended up costing me more
> as I bought the more expensive better-built product when the cheaper
> one broke...and since then those computers haven't failed (except for
> uncontrollable circumstances, that is).
>
> Just look at the motherboards.  Maybe you don't purchase them, but
> other people do.  OutletPC is a JOKE.  I can't stress that enough.
> Their selection is comprised of mostly cheaper lower end older
> products, and not even many of those.  Want a great example of how
> much of a ripoff it can be?  Their best LGA775 mobo is this gigabyte
> one that's priced at $130 (http://www.outletpc.com/c3583.html), while
> Newegg has the same one at $82
> (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128017R).
> That is a price difference of $52, my friend.  Enough to buy an entire
> 1 gigabyte more of RAM, or to buy another DVD burner - 18x SATA, if
> you wanted.  OutletPC doesn't even have the better cousin of that
> motherboard that Newegg does
> (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128012).
> And outletpc also doesn't have higher-up models from that Gigabyte
> one, whatsoever.
>
> On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
>> mounting a processor really isn't that hard. lift the arm, seat the
>> processor and then put the paste on, put the heat sync on top and tack it
>> down
>
> It's pretty important that there be an even layer of thermal paste on
> top before mounting the heat sink.  However, there are some processors
> that come with heatsinks that come with a sticker of sorts instead,
> it's like a thin layer of thermal compound that eventually melts
> properly after the computer's been in use, and it's preapplied to the
> heatsink and you only have to take off the protective plastic...that
> may be an option for you.
>
> Haphazardly applying paste is not the smartest way to go about things.
> Although it might sound simpler to apply way more than you need and
> just smoosh the heatsink down, that will indeed cause heating issues -
> to the point that you might just destroy the overheating processor
> because the heatsink isn't dissipating the heat correctly because of
> the misapplication of paste.  What you want is a very thin evenly
> spread layer.  Best to follow the directions (manufacturers often have
> a certain "method" or so they recommend to minimize the chance of
> bubbles and imperfections), and to use good thermal paste as well.
>
> cheers,
> jane
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

Maybe also spread some on some foil or paper, stick it down on the 
processor, then lifting it. That should be good.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 11:14 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 11:37:07AM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote:
>> You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the 
>> type of CPU you are installing,
>> otherwise heat issues can arrise.
>
> Also, I've been told that you definitely don't want to get even a bit
> of the stuff on the mb components around the socket. When it
> comes to actually applying compound to the cpu, supposedly you don't
> want to go touching the freshly applied compound, because of skin
> oils. So, going back to evenly spreading it, it would be very
> difficult, if not impossible to do that, without feeling around.
>
> Greg
>
>
> - -- 
> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
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> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
>
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>
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> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[W. Nick Dotson]

Don't forget the good old weasel (spelling?) card, in in the good ole days, the Braille Display Processor, from VTEK, for which I was Product manager, and 
prior to that the Large Pring Display Processor.  And, there was the Frank (spelling?) Audio Data device, and Speakuelizer (spelling?)...  Things were so 
exciting and simpler then, but I'm so spoiled, I can hardly stand to use my 750MHz XP box anymore, and when I got it, I was in heaven with it's speed.  It 
and 2 500MHz boxes will make up my Linux Farm, when I get up the courage to beg Janina to reboot my lost Linux internal Knowledge Base, as I've lost the 
ability to get my 1 500MHz box to "do right" and lack sufficient knowledge to even begin to know where and how to get it back under my control.  I'm the 
proverbial savage doing Magic where Linux is concerned, but am so very comfortable in the evil Gatesian world.  (sheepish blush)

Nick

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 16:56:56 -0700, Gregory Nowak wrote:

 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
 Hash: SHA1

 On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 06:38:34PM -0400, Cody wrote:
 > The only thing you will have trouble with is connecting the small 
 > wires from the front of the case to the mother board for the led lights and 
 > the power button. 

 Well, there are a couple more things you'll need sighted help
 for. First, as was mentioned, applying cpu compound, and installing
 the heat sink. These days, since the bios screens are gui-based,
 you'll need sighted help with configuring the bios as well. This used
 to not be the case back in the days of text-based bios menus, and
 machines with parallel ports, provided you had a way of speaking text
 sent out the parallel port, a braille blazer being one example of one
 such device.

 Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 10:37:06PM -0500, Glenn Ervin wrote:
> I remember a friend was watching me work on a computer, and he said that I 
> should use a grounding strap, and I said "Why?", my arm is always on the 
> frame anyway.
> Maybe sighted folks hold their arms in the air while working on a computer, 
> but I'll bet we all steady our hands by resting our arm on the body of the 
> computer.

In that case, you'd probably also want to bet that we all wear short
sleeves at all times when working on a pc, and I personally don't
always do that. All the machines I have here are towers, and I don't
want to go through the hassle of fully unplugging them just to work in
them, so I work with the tower cases standing like they normally
would, which means my elbows are usually on the ground. Even if
working on a desktop, most of the time, I work on those with the
machine facing me, like it normally does, which means that even if you
do lean an arm on the chassis, usually the bulk of your arm is
actually in contact with the plastic on the front of the chassis, and
not with the metal frame. You also want to be in contact with an
unpainted metal part of the chassis, (the best place is usually the
outside of the power supply at the back of the chassis), since painted
metal surfaces don't do the job.

Personally, if I'm doing something quick and dirty, such as swapping
cards in and out, I'll touch the back of the case with 1 hand, while
working with the other. If I'm doing anything major though, especially
if I need both hands inside, I do use a wrist strap. After all, it
takes very little static electricity (which you might not even feel),
to destroy 1 or more components.

Greg


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=fRIa
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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 09:05:51PM -0700, Butch Bussen wrote:
> I agree with most of this, but I've never had any trouble with the 
> compound.  It is just a silicon compound and doesn't hurt if you get some 
> on  your fingers.

Like I said in another post, from what I know, the problem isn't with
getting the compound on your fingers, the problem is with getting oil
from your skin onto the freshly applied compound. I do stand to be
corrected there though, they say you learn something new every day
after all.

> I 
> haven't done any newer boards, but on the stuff I use to mess with, you 
> also had to set jumpers and dip switches depending on what cpu you had, 
> voltage, speed and so forth.  I don't know if you have to do this on the 
> newer stuff or not.

Yes, that was true for the older boards. I haven't done any of the
newer boards either, (since 2002), but I've been told by people who have, that the boards
you get today do all that stuff in the bios, and they don't have more
than 2-3 jumpers on the whole board.

Greg


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-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> Forgot to mention i went to the memory section and I am not in any way
> paying over $200 for a ddr2 800 stick of ram when I can get it elsewhere for
> $35 or $50. That is pricy. Saw nothing below $90 for the type of ram I
> needed.

Got any idea as to how much you want, with which timings, et cetera?
All you're giving are cost, nothing in regards to specs.  For all I
know, you could be grabbing the cheapest product from one and the most
expensive from the other.  That's no comparison.

Straight comparisons of the cheap generic ram to quality
mushkin/ocz/crucial etc. aren't that fantastic because they differ so
much in specs although they might functionally be the same RAM on the
surface.  And I assure you that Newegg is not expensive when it comes
to memory.

You want cheap ddr2 800?
cheapo 512mb, $19.99 - buy 4 and be under your $90 limit:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820141063

512mb from ocz, 43.99, two of which are still under your $90 limit:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227125

cheapo 1gb, 32.99, again, two of these would be under $90, or buy
three to go over it just a bit:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820211062

decent 1gb from mushkin, 44.99, hey will you look at that, two is
still under $90:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146117

Now, what's actually over $200?  The 2gb dual channel kits are
$200-300 - 2 sticks of 2gb ram for a total of 4gb.  Which is entirely
reasonable, given that 1gb is about $30-50.  Newegg doesn't sell any
single sticks for $200.  Not even close.

Now, cody, honestly, if you can find any retailer that will sell you
4gb of ddr2 800 ram for $35, or even $90, please link it.  That's
almost too cheap to be true.  Preferably from a good manufacturer,
too.

And you want to know the kicker about this whole thing?  outletpc
doesn't even have ddr2 800 ram.

cheers,
jane

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Cody]

Mid range is what I'm looking for I need nothing fancy.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jane Lee" <applegoddess@gmail.com>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2007 1:01 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> On 9/13/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
>> Forgot to mention i went to the memory section and I am not in any way
>> paying over $200 for a ddr2 800 stick of ram when I can get it elsewhere 
>> for
>> $35 or $50. That is pricy. Saw nothing below $90 for the type of ram I
>> needed.
>
> Got any idea as to how much you want, with which timings, et cetera?
> All you're giving are cost, nothing in regards to specs.  For all I
> know, you could be grabbing the cheapest product from one and the most
> expensive from the other.  That's no comparison.
>
> Straight comparisons of the cheap generic ram to quality
> mushkin/ocz/crucial etc. aren't that fantastic because they differ so
> much in specs although they might functionally be the same RAM on the
> surface.  And I assure you that Newegg is not expensive when it comes
> to memory.
>
> You want cheap ddr2 800?
> cheapo 512mb, $19.99 - buy 4 and be under your $90 limit:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820141063
>
> 512mb from ocz, 43.99, two of which are still under your $90 limit:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227125
>
> cheapo 1gb, 32.99, again, two of these would be under $90, or buy
> three to go over it just a bit:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820211062
>
> decent 1gb from mushkin, 44.99, hey will you look at that, two is
> still under $90:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146117
>
> Now, what's actually over $200?  The 2gb dual channel kits are
> $200-300 - 2 sticks of 2gb ram for a total of 4gb.  Which is entirely
> reasonable, given that 1gb is about $30-50.  Newegg doesn't sell any
> single sticks for $200.  Not even close.
>
> Now, cody, honestly, if you can find any retailer that will sell you
> 4gb of ddr2 800 ram for $35, or even $90, please link it.  That's
> almost too cheap to be true.  Preferably from a good manufacturer,
> too.
>
> And you want to know the kicker about this whole thing?  outletpc
> doesn't even have ddr2 800 ram.
>
> cheers,
> jane
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date: 
> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

yeah, but you need something that will press it. because if you use your 
fingers to push it down it won't be even. :)
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cody" <churst35@verizon.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 9:49 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Maybe also spread some on some foil or paper, stick it down on the
> processor, then lifting it. That should be good.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
> To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." 
> <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 11:14 PM
> Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?
>
>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 11:37:07AM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote:
>>> You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the
>>> type of CPU you are installing,
>>> otherwise heat issues can arrise.
>>
>> Also, I've been told that you definitely don't want to get even a bit
>> of the stuff on the mb components around the socket. When it
>> comes to actually applying compound to the cpu, supposedly you don't
>> want to go touching the freshly applied compound, because of skin
>> oils. So, going back to evenly spreading it, it would be very
>> difficult, if not impossible to do that, without feeling around.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>>
>> - -- 
>> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
>> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
>> skype: gregn1
>> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
>>
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>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
>>
>> iD8DBQFG6fyd7s9z/XlyUyARAltRAJ98qZk/f2wpUk4ER4LWbx0kU7voDQCeJBgO
>> 2NULKvUZvO1Oydhw3MJoVZ8=
>> =HRTI
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Speakup mailing list
>> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
>> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.16/1005 - Release Date:
>> 9/13/2007 11:45 AM
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Butch Bussen]

I suppose it isn't a good idea to get oil from hyour skin on the compound, 
but I've applied it that way for years, both on boards and on very large 
high power transistors in commercial gear and have never had a problem. 
Often what I'd do is put a big glob on the surface and use the heat sink 
or whatever to smash the stuff and spread it around when I mount it.  You 
can wipe away the access.  As far as getting it on near by components, 
again, probasbly not a good idea, but this stuff doesn't conduct, so I 
don't see a lot of harm in that, just wipe away what you can.
73s
Butch Bussen
wa0vjr

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

I installed my own CPU/heat sink/fan with no sighted help on more than
one occasion. It's pretty easy if you can figure out how everything fits
together. And it isn't going to fit the wrong way, so no sighted help is
needed. Of course I could be wrong about Intel processors since I've
only installed AMD so far, but if Intel does require sighted help to
install the CPU then that's just one more reason for me to steer clear
of their products.

Live long and prosper,
Lorenzo

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Lorenzo Taylor]

I bought an AMD Athlon64x2 CPU last February. It came with a thin film
on the heat sink where it makes contact with the processor itself. There
was no additional compound to spread on the CPU. All I had to do was to
put the CPU into the socket and mount the heat sink. I have had
absolutely no heat issues. In fact, this processor runs much cooler than
the Athlon XP 1800+ I had last year, and it was installed on its
motherboard when I left the store.

Qapla'!
Lorenzo

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[John Heim]

Instead of having someone do it for you, have them help you do it yourself.

You probably don't need to know how to  assemble a computer from scratch. 
But knowing how to replace a hard drive and RAM is a valuable skill. In some 
ways, being blind is an advantage because very often, when you're replacing 
parts, you can't see anyway. And being comfortable doing something like 
replacing RAM by feel is helpful.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Smith" <dougsmith1@charter.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> How did all of you learn how to build a computer from scratch, or even
> upgrade one without sighted help?  I was always told never to mess
> inside mine without sighted help, or, better, yet, let someone who can
> see do it for me.  This is what I have always done.  How can I learn
> to build and upgrade a computer without sighted assistance?
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
> Computer Scientist For CHRIST
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
>
> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[John Heim]

Maybe you could wear latex gloves when applying the glue.

I just bought a mobo and cpu. I was planning on doing everything myself with 
sighted supervision. From a practical point of view though, you probably 
don't need to know how to  mount a cpu. You could buy a bare bones computer 
for about the same price that you can buy the parts seperately. I'm doing it 
just to do it.

On the other hand, things like replacing RAM, cards, and hard drives come up 
often enough that it would be good to know how to do that. And those things 
aren't particularly difficult for blind people.



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Nowak" <greg@romuald.net.eu.org>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2007 10:14 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 11:37:07AM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote:
>> You have to make sure the compound is evenly spread correctly for the 
>> type of CPU you are installing,
>> otherwise heat issues can arrise.
>
> Also, I've been told that you definitely don't want to get even a bit
> of the stuff on the mb components around the socket. When it
> comes to actually applying compound to the cpu, supposedly you don't
> want to go touching the freshly applied compound, because of skin
> oils. So, going back to evenly spreading it, it would be very
> difficult, if not impossible to do that, without feeling around.
>
> Greg
>
>
> - -- 
> web site: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org
> gpg public key: http://www.romuald.net.eu.org/pubkey.asc
> skype: gregn1
> (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first)
>
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> Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-manager@EU.org
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFG6fyd7s9z/XlyUyARAltRAJ98qZk/f2wpUk4ER4LWbx0kU7voDQCeJBgO
> 2NULKvUZvO1Oydhw3MJoVZ8=
> =HRTI
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>
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> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup
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> 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Smith]

I guess you wouldn't want to overclock.  The chief reason I can think
of for this is the expense of buying another chip when you burn it up.
It does sound like fun to have the thing going much faster than it is
designed to do, and you might even need it.  

I had often wondered how to overclock.  I thought you had to put some
kind of other clock chip on the MB so that it would drive the entire
thing faster.  

Well, that's interesting.  I finally found out that you do it just by
adjusting a jumper.  



Thanks. 




-- 
Doug Smith: C.S.F.C.
Computer Scientist For CHRIST

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Sutherland]

Overclocking, how it is done, depends on the processor and the 
motherboard. On some motherboards, actually it's the BIOS, 
you can change the clock multipliers in BIOS. Others may have
jumpers, but in some cases you have to actually modify the 
processor using a tedious process of changing on chip jumpers.
I wouldn't want to mess with the latter option. My motherboard
allows changing the bus and cpu clock in bios. What will happen
though, unless you add new cooling methods is often the OS
will crash due to corrupted bus data, memory data, or even 
instructions. Overclocking should be considered just a hobby
for the purpose of "because you can". It's really not useful for
regular apps unless you have lots of time and patience to try 
many different clocking schemes. If you do plan to overclock
then get better heat sink and better fans for processor and 
the case itself.

  -- Doug

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 10:30:38AM -0500, John Heim wrote:
> Maybe you could wear latex gloves when applying the glue.

Hmmm, you know, maybe not a bad idea, haven't thought of that. The
only down-side to wearing gloves is that you lose some sensitivity in
terms of feel, but it could probably still be done. Anyway, blindness
isn't my only disability, so even if I was able to apply the compound
myself, I don't have the finger strength and coordination required to
lock the heat sink into place, so I'd still need someone else to do
that for me. In that case, might as well have them apply the compound
too.

> You could buy a bare bones computer 
> for about the same price that you can buy the parts seperately.

The problem with bear bones systems is that the bear bones parts can
be proprietary. I got an amtron bookpc in around 2000, June I believe
it was. The mb burned out, and I had to wait about 9 months for them
to get me a new one under warranty, since no other motherboards would
match that particular bear bones design. When the second mb went, I
just gave up on that system, and built one from scratch, that is a
regular system in a regular tower case.

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

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On Fri, Sep 14, 2007 at 12:54:39PM -0400, Doug Smith wrote:
> I guess you wouldn't want to overclock.  The chief reason I can think
> of for this is the expense of buying another chip when you burn it up.
> It does sound like fun to have the thing going much faster than it is
> designed to do, and you might even need it.  

That's not the only reason. From my own experience, and from what I've
heard from others, you actually lose performance when you over-clock,
which I know sounds counter-intuitive, but it's true. I actually
measured it in some way in 2000, so I don't recall what I did anymore,
but the end-result is that I stopped over-clocking from that day on,
and have run cpus at their stated speeds since that day.

> Well, that's interesting.  I finally found out that you do it just by
> adjusting a jumper.  
> 

You used to do it that way. Like I said, you do it these days through
the bios, if the mb lets you.

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Janina Sajka]

Or, just go get one of the new quad core processors, one of which Newegg
is currently selling for $275.

Janina

Doug Sutherland writes:
> Overclocking, how it is done, depends on the processor and the 
> motherboard. On some motherboards, actually it's the BIOS, 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Janina Sajka]

Gregory Nowak writes:
> > You could buy a bare bones computer 
> > for about the same price that you can buy the parts seperately.
> 
> The problem with bear bones systems is that the bear bones parts can
> be proprietary.

Well, you will want to avoid the proprietary, of course. You'll want to
know that what you're buying is directly supported by Linux. But, if you
do that, you can get a much better system for about the same money. I
did this year. Here's what I got about 5/6 months ago, and what I would
tweak today ...

Asus Pundit P3-PH5 bare bones -- Caso, power supply and socket 775 mobo,
about $200

I paid $30 to significantly enhance the cpu fan with a Zerotherm 
PU \x02Cooler

I paid about $30 for a DVD/CDR burner.

I paid around $240 for an Intel dual-core 6600 CPU, key factoid being
the 4-Mb L2 cache. Very nice, but I'm already looking at swapping it for
the $275 quad-core.

I paid about $116 each for two 1Gb sticks of fast OCZ memory.

I got a 500Gb 7200 RPM Western Digital SATA disk with 16Mb cache to use
for file storage for about $110.

So far, the above all came from Newegg.

Lastly, I bought a couple of 10K RPM 36Gb SATA disks, also 16Mb cache,
on Ebay for around $40 each. One of those two is the slash partition on
this system I'm describing. Admittedly, this was a darn good price for
this disk.

This gave me a smoking fast system for around $900. It's also an
extensible system. I can go up to 8Gb in RAM in four slots. And, as I
said, I'm already looking at swapping the dual-core for a quadcore--same
socket.

Best of all, Fedora 7 just installed--over PXE no less. Yes, I needed to
get sighted assistance to configure the bios to look for PXE on power
up, and I accepted help installing the parts, because I'm not
particularly good at that.

Every device is natively recognized and properly supported by Fedora. It
just works, and I love it. Can you buy a system for under $900? Yes, you
can. Can you buy a system like this for less? Not today--unless you put
it together from parts. Probably not for another year or so.


Janina

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Jane Lee]

On 9/14/07, Cody <churst35@verizon.net> wrote:
> Mid range is what I'm looking for I need nothing fancy.

And I assure you, Newegg will have what you're looking for, AND give
you some variety.  Even if you're looking for mid-range pricing, there
are plenty of awesome dual channel kits that are heavily discounted on
newegg, $60-70 for 2x1gb shipped e.g.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227231

On 9/14/07, Doug Smith <dougsmith1@charter.net> wrote:
> I guess you wouldn't want to overclock.  The chief reason I can think
> of for this is the expense of buying another chip when you burn it up.
> It does sound like fun to have the thing going much faster than it is
> designed to do, and you might even need it.

I used to be really into overclocking..at some point I had a liquid
cooled setup (vs. air with fans) and all...unless you have good
hardware and a good cooling system, I really don't recommend it,
because things will overheat and not be very nice.

If you're contemplating it, DFI is a motherboard manufacturer that
sells mostly high end enthusiast-quality stuff that's absolutely
fantastic for overclocking (and gaming too, hehe).  I'm a huge fan of
their lanparty mobos...wanted to get one after the one in my gaming
box got screwed up (older DFI mobo, but it was fried by an ignorant
guest), but Fry's didn't have it and I really needed a replacement
that day, sigh.  Later, though.  Grin.

cheers,
jane

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Sutherland]

I wasted a LOT of time not even overclocking, but just trying 
to get a 1GB DDR RAM running at the speed advertised as 
supported by my motherboard. In the process, I learned what 
happens when the clocks, either bus or cpu, are set too high. 
The system becomes unstable. It will crash. I  really don't 
recommend overclocking, unless it's a small tweak, or just for
fun. So I would agree, if you need a faster machine, better to
get a faster processor. Don't buy a slower processor with 
the expectation that you'll make it faster and save money. 
It is really not worth the hassle.

  -- Doug

Janina wrote:
> Or, just go get one of the new quad core processors, one of which Newegg
> is currently selling for $275.

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Gregory Nowak]

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On Thu, Sep 13, 2007 at 11:49:50PM -0400, Cody wrote:
> Maybe also spread some on some foil or paper, stick it down on the 
> processor, then lifting it. That should be good.

Have you actually done this, or are you just suggesting it as a
possibility. If you've done that, then did you use foil, paper, or
both? If both, then which one did the job better, or were they both
the same?

Greg


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Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Sutherland]

A new processor, as was already mentioned, usually 
has a self adhesive thermal conductive sticker with it.
So usually you only need to use the paste if you 
change processors. If you buy the processor kits 
that come with the heatsink, then you'll probably 
get the self adhesive sticky thing. Ask before buying
if it has this. If you do need to use paste, not a lot of
the stuff is required. It's also expensive, so might be 
better to just buy the kits with the cpu and heatsink.

  -- Doug

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

sure. I'll get one of them 275$ processors, if you want to buy it, and put 
it in for me :)
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Sutherland" <doug@proficio.ca>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2007 7:34 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>I wasted a LOT of time not even overclocking, but just trying
> to get a 1GB DDR RAM running at the speed advertised as
> supported by my motherboard. In the process, I learned what
> happens when the clocks, either bus or cpu, are set too high.
> The system becomes unstable. It will crash. I  really don't
> recommend overclocking, unless it's a small tweak, or just for
> fun. So I would agree, if you need a faster machine, better to
> get a faster processor. Don't buy a slower processor with
> the expectation that you'll make it faster and save money.
> It is really not worth the hassle.
>
>  -- Doug
>
> Janina wrote:
>> Or, just go get one of the new quad core processors, one of which Newegg
>> is currently selling for $275.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Doug Sutherland]

I didn't say get THAT processor hehe.
I said don't get a slow one thinking it's easy to make it faster.
It might work, it might not, it will take a lot of your time.

The truth is that what makes a processor 2.2Gz or 3.3Ghz
is often just testing. They rate them based on how well they
do in tests. You could get lucky and be able to overclock 
a lot or you could only get 200Mhz before the OS tries to
write something somehwere that doesn't exist because the
address is corrupted.

  -- Doug

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

sorry. should have pasted message. was refering to yours.
I know what you're saying... I think it's still worth overclocking though, 
if you're willing to test. 200 mhz extra would be nice. :)
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Sutherland" <doug@proficio.ca>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2007 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


>I didn't say get THAT processor hehe.
> I said don't get a slow one thinking it's easy to make it faster.
> It might work, it might not, it will take a lot of your time.
>
> The truth is that what makes a processor 2.2Gz or 3.3Ghz
> is often just testing. They rate them based on how well they
> do in tests. You could get lucky and be able to overclock
> a lot or you could only get 200Mhz before the OS tries to
> write something somehwere that doesn't exist because the
> address is corrupted.
>
>  -- Doug
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Janina Sajka]

Littlefield, Tyler writes:
> I know what you're saying... I think it's still worth overclocking though, 
> if you're willing to test. 200 mhz extra would be nice. :)

I mentioned a quad core at Newegg for $275. The same chip, with 2.6 G
performance sells at Newegg for $534. In other words, the manufacturer
tests and rates the CPU, and the price reflects the testing. Are you
suggesting your tests are more hontest? Surely not--but then what? Is
that 2.4 G CPU for $275 somehow actually capable of 2.6 G, but they
decided to let it slide through at the lower price? What are you saying?

CPUs are simply built. Then they're tested. The ones that perform at the
higher speeds, get the higher price. In this instance, we're talking
double the price for 8% more speed. Makes me think of asking if you want
to buy a bridge.

Janina

aren't honest?

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Littlefield, Tyler]

If you think that computer companies and other people always tell the truth, 
then you've been sheltered.
It is probably possible, through overclocking, to get the processor to do 
more than it will normally. Just like you can speed up windblows by changing 
things. But... It's not already done for you.
Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield.
Vertigo head coder
"My programs don't have bugs, just randomly added features."
msn: compgeek134@hotmail.com
email: compgeek13@gmail.com
aim: st8amnd2005
skype: st8amnd127
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina@rednote.net>
To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." <speakup@braille.uwo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2007 9:07 AM
Subject: Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?


> Littlefield, Tyler writes:
>> I know what you're saying... I think it's still worth overclocking 
>> though,
>> if you're willing to test. 200 mhz extra would be nice. :)
>
> I mentioned a quad core at Newegg for $275. The same chip, with 2.6 G
> performance sells at Newegg for $534. In other words, the manufacturer
> tests and rates the CPU, and the price reflects the testing. Are you
> suggesting your tests are more hontest? Surely not--but then what? Is
> that 2.4 G CPU for $275 somehow actually capable of 2.6 G, but they
> decided to let it slide through at the lower price? What are you saying?
>
> CPUs are simply built. Then they're tested. The ones that perform at the
> higher speeds, get the higher price. In this instance, we're talking
> double the price for 8% more speed. Makes me think of asking if you want
> to buy a bridge.
>
> Janina
>
> aren't honest?
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Speakup mailing list
> Speakup@braille.uwo.ca
> http://speech.braille.uwo.ca/mailman/listinfo/speakup 

Re: ot: the best online computer parts store?

[Janina Sajka]

I don't follow your logic, Tyler. How do you believe Intel comes to
classify one Kentsfield 6600 quad-core CPU as 2.6G, and the next one as
2.4G. What is the process, as you conceive it? Here are a dozen CPUs,
fresh off the assembly line. What happens? Do they throw them up in the
air to see which bin they fall into?

Littlefield, Tyler writes:
> If you think that computer companies and other people always tell the truth, 
> then you've been sheltered.
> It is probably possible, through overclocking, to get the processor to do 
> more than it will normally. Just like you can speed up windblows by changing 
> things. But... It's not already done for you.
> Thanks,
> Tyler Littlefield.