Mutt or Alpine

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

So I'm using Mutt, but...

What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use one over 
the other?

Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly without 
making temporary files while composing a message (unles I can tell 
Mutt/Neomutt to delete those automatically

So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with Orca?

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

If you want to use an email client with Orca, stick to Thunderbird.

I find Orca unwieldy in the terminal anyway.

If, however, you wish to do so with Speakup or Fenrir, I personally prefer 
Alpine.

Why? Simple. I don't know Mutt at all.

Warm regards,

Brandt Steenkamp

Sent from the Slint console using Alpine

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:00:22 +0000
> From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> To: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> Subject: Mutt or Alpine
> 
> So I'm using Mutt, but...
>
> What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use one over the 
> other?
>
> Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly without making 
> temporary files while composing a message (unles I can tell Mutt/Neomutt to 
> delete those automatically
>
> So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with Orca?
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

My issue with Alpine though is it's losing my IMAP mails, like I've 
several with attachments that Alpine skips right over and Mutt displays 
fine however, so I'm not sure if that's a problem with Alpine? My Gmail 
terminal setup works fine in Mutt however, which is doubly weird

Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> If you want to use an email client with Orca, stick to Thunderbird.
>
> I find Orca unwieldy in the terminal anyway.
>
> If, however, you wish to do so with Speakup or Fenrir, I personally 
> prefer Alpine.
>
> Why? Simple. I don't know Mutt at all.
>
> Warm regards,
>
> Brandt Steenkamp
>
> Sent from the Slint console using Alpine
>
> On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
>
>> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:00:22 +0000
>> From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
>> To: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
>> Subject: Mutt or Alpine
>>
>> So I'm using Mutt, but...
>>
>> What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use one 
>> over the other?
>>
>> Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly without 
>> making temporary files while composing a message (unles I can tell 
>> Mutt/Neomutt to delete those automatically
>>
>> So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with Orca?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Blinux-list mailing list
>> Blinux-list at redhat.com
>> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

Belatedly, Mutt (I don't have Neomutt on this machine, because...thanks 
Solus?) works really, really well in a terminal oddly enough as well as 
a pure console. Alpine sadly doesn't so at least for my use case, Mutt 
wins out

Now to figure out if Mutt or Neomutt is a better fit? I'd say you can 
probably ransition from Alpine to Mutt with a bit of a learning curve, 
for me Alpine took more getting used to in my brief tests. I like the 
layout o Alpine. But Mutt, at least on my machine, works better with 
Orca in? a terminal, I don't run into horizontally laid out things, Mutt 
has it listed alphabetically so I know or example my Blinux folder is 
always at the top of the heap, Inbox is option #5 and so forth. To me 
that makes more sense than having Inbox/Drafts/etc all on one line, but 
YMMV on that of course, Alpine isn't available in the default Arch repos 
but a quick git clone https://aur.archlinux.org/yay-bin, installing that 
and then yay -S alpine sorts that out however

Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> If you want to use an email client with Orca, stick to Thunderbird.
>
> I find Orca unwieldy in the terminal anyway.
>
> If, however, you wish to do so with Speakup or Fenrir, I personally 
> prefer Alpine.
>
> Why? Simple. I don't know Mutt at all.
>
> Warm regards,
>
> Brandt Steenkamp
>
> Sent from the Slint console using Alpine
>
> On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
>
>> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:00:22 +0000
>> From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
>> To: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
>> Subject: Mutt or Alpine
>>
>> So I'm using Mutt, but...
>>
>> What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use one 
>> over the other?
>>
>> Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly without 
>> making temporary files while composing a message (unles I can tell 
>> Mutt/Neomutt to delete those automatically
>>
>> So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with Orca?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Blinux-list mailing list
>> Blinux-list at redhat.com
>> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

Tim here.  I've used both mutt/neomutt and alpine (and pine back in
the day).

The big advantage of mutt/neomutt is power/flexibility.  I've found
that it's less of a mail-reader and more a toolkit for creating your
custom mail-reader experience from the parts that it brings to the
table.  And everything is configured using the ~/.muttrc file alone
(no nice user-interface for tweaking settings) which can be daunting
if you don't have a solid grasp of what's going on under the hood.
It plays well with external tools like notmuch for indexing and your
mailcap definitions for using external programs to open attachments,
or using urlview/urlscan to search a message-body for URLs to open.
It's still not great at multi-account, requiring a lot of manual care
in setting it up (this is my biggest frustration in using it, and the
main reason I don't use it more frequently).

As far as *easier*, alpine wins pretty hands-down.  It has a
settings-editing interface for configuring pretty much everything.
Like Pico/Nano, it also keeps the list of commands along the bottom
of the screen, making it more new-user friendly.  It has a concept of
"roles" which I haven't explored recently, but it sounds like a way
to manage multiple accounts better than mutt/neomutt does.

-tim



On February 18, 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> If you want to use an email client with Orca, stick to Thunderbird.
> 
> I find Orca unwieldy in the terminal anyway.
> 
> If, however, you wish to do so with Speakup or Fenrir, I personally
> prefer Alpine.
> 
> Why? Simple. I don't know Mutt at all.
> 
> Warm regards,
> 
> Brandt Steenkamp
> 
> Sent from the Slint console using Alpine
> 
> On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> 
> > Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:00:22 +0000
> > From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> > To: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> > Subject: Mutt or Alpine
> > 
> > So I'm using Mutt, but...
> >
> > What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use
> > one over the other?
> >
> > Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly
> > without making temporary files while composing a message (unles I
> > can tell Mutt/Neomutt to delete those automatically
> >
> > So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with
> > Orca?
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list at redhat.com
> > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> >
> >  
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> 

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

Mutt comes with the fleacollar.sh script that gets much of the setup done
though it's a little weak on setting up gpg2.


On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> Tim here.  I've used both mutt/neomutt and alpine (and pine back in
> the day).
>
> The big advantage of mutt/neomutt is power/flexibility.  I've found
> that it's less of a mail-reader and more a toolkit for creating your
> custom mail-reader experience from the parts that it brings to the
> table.  And everything is configured using the ~/.muttrc file alone
> (no nice user-interface for tweaking settings) which can be daunting
> if you don't have a solid grasp of what's going on under the hood.
> It plays well with external tools like notmuch for indexing and your
> mailcap definitions for using external programs to open attachments,
> or using urlview/urlscan to search a message-body for URLs to open.
> It's still not great at multi-account, requiring a lot of manual care
> in setting it up (this is my biggest frustration in using it, and the
> main reason I don't use it more frequently).
>
> As far as *easier*, alpine wins pretty hands-down.  It has a
> settings-editing interface for configuring pretty much everything.
> Like Pico/Nano, it also keeps the list of commands along the bottom
> of the screen, making it more new-user friendly.  It has a concept of
> "roles" which I haven't explored recently, but it sounds like a way
> to manage multiple accounts better than mutt/neomutt does.
>
> -tim
>
>
>
> On February 18, 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> > If you want to use an email client with Orca, stick to Thunderbird.
> >
> > I find Orca unwieldy in the terminal anyway.
> >
> > If, however, you wish to do so with Speakup or Fenrir, I personally
> > prefer Alpine.
> >
> > Why? Simple. I don't know Mutt at all.
> >
> > Warm regards,
> >
> > Brandt Steenkamp
> >
> > Sent from the Slint console using Alpine
> >
> > On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> >
> > > Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:00:22 +0000
> > > From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> > > To: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> > > Subject: Mutt or Alpine
> > >
> > > So I'm using Mutt, but...
> > >
> > > What does Mutt have over Alpine and vice versa, why would I use
> > > one over the other?
> > >
> > > Mutt seems faster to me, but Alpine seems more user friendly
> > > without making temporary files while composing a message (unles I
> > > can tell Mutt/Neomutt to delete those automatically
> > >
> > > So is there a consensus of which is the easier choice to use with
> > > Orca?
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Blinux-list mailing list
> > > Blinux-list at redhat.com
> > > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list at redhat.com
> > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>

Mutt or Alpine

[blinux-list]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

7> Belatedly, Mutt (I don't have Neomutt on this machine, because...thanks 
> Solus?) works really, really well in a terminal oddly enough as well as a 
> pure console. Alpine sadly doesn't so at least for my use case, Mutt wins out
>
> Now to figure out if Mutt or Neomutt is a better fit? I'd say you can 
> probably ransition from Alpine to Mutt with a bit of a learning curve, for me

> Alpine. But Mutt, at least on my machine, works better with Orca in? a 
> terminal, I don't run into horizontally laid out things, Mutt has it listed 
> alphabetically so I know or example my Blinux folder is always at the top of 
> the heap, Inbox is option #5 and so forth. To me that makes more sense than 
> having Inbox/Drafts/etc all on one line, but YMMV on that of course, ...

You can fix this in ALPINE by setting

single-column-folder-list

I would think that most of us here would want this feature set.

HTH,
Geoff.

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

It's an undocumented configuration option,
compensate-for-deficient-imap-servers
I have it set in my .pinerc file.  By undocumented I mean if you're on any
option in configuration and you hit control-g you should get an
explanation of what the option does whether on or off.  This one has none.


On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
>
> > One over-arching consideration especially with
> > software and more generally with operating systems is length of support.
> > With operating systems much email is sent on other lists whether to
> > upgrade or not.  Very simply, everyone has a choice of upgrade or bail.
> > In the case of bail, the move gets made to different operating systems.
>
> Regarding ALPINE support, there is a good low-traffic mailing list which
> provides good support.  The current maintainer is an active participant there.
>
> http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info
>
> HTH,
> Geoff.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

That's my main gripe with Alpine, the fact it loses track of IMAP
messages in gmail whereas Mutt doesn't. I've not found a way to fix that
> If anyone would like, I can share my .pinerc file so you can see what I
> have going with alpine.  One over-arching consideration especially with
> software and more generally with operating systems is length of support.
> With operating systems much email is sent on other lists whether to
> upgrade or not.  Very simply, everyone has a choice of upgrade or bail.
> In the case of bail, the move gets made to different operating systems.
> 
> 
> On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> 
> > There was and maybe still is a website called dotfiles.org.  It had
> > configuration files on it for various programs people found useful.  If
> > the website still exists the linux blindness lists might be able to
> > contribute to it but anyone who does so will help others in our community
> > by commenting their configuration files appropriately perhaps with a
> > #braille-friendly or #console-screen-reader-friendly or a
> > #graphical-screen-reader-friendly tag.  This way we have a chance to build
> > our capabilities and those that find these configuration files in the
> > future.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list at redhat.com
> > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> >
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> 

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

Sure thing. I'm still having a problem of Alpine skipping out on a whole 
day's worth of emails. Like it goes from the 9th to the 11th and skips 
out on the 10th o Feb while that deisplays fine in Mutt, Gmail web, etc. 
So any ideas what's up with that?

Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> If anyone would like, I can share my .pinerc file so you can see what I
> have going with alpine.  One over-arching consideration especially with
> software and more generally with operating systems is length of support.
> With operating systems much email is sent on other lists whether to
> upgrade or not.  Very simply, everyone has a choice of upgrade or bail.
> In the case of bail, the move gets made to different operating systems.
>
>
> On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
>
>> There was and maybe still is a website called dotfiles.org.  It had
>> configuration files on it for various programs people found useful.  If
>> the website still exists the linux blindness lists might be able to
>> contribute to it but anyone who does so will help others in our community
>> by commenting their configuration files appropriately perhaps with a
>> #braille-friendly or #console-screen-reader-friendly or a
>> #graphical-screen-reader-friendly tag.  This way we have a chance to build
>> our capabilities and those that find these configuration files in the
>> future.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Blinux-list mailing list
>> Blinux-list at redhat.com
>> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> One over-arching consideration especially with
> software and more generally with operating systems is length of support.
> With operating systems much email is sent on other lists whether to
> upgrade or not.  Very simply, everyone has a choice of upgrade or bail.
> In the case of bail, the move gets made to different operating systems.

Regarding ALPINE support, there is a good low-traffic mailing list which 
provides good support.  The current maintainer is an active participant 
there.

http://mailman12.u.washington.edu/mailman/listinfo/alpine-info

HTH,
Geoff.

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

If anyone would like, I can share my .pinerc file so you can see what I
have going with alpine.  One over-arching consideration especially with
software and more generally with operating systems is length of support.
With operating systems much email is sent on other lists whether to
upgrade or not.  Very simply, everyone has a choice of upgrade or bail.
In the case of bail, the move gets made to different operating systems.


On Mon, 21 Feb 2022, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> There was and maybe still is a website called dotfiles.org.  It had
> configuration files on it for various programs people found useful.  If
> the website still exists the linux blindness lists might be able to
> contribute to it but anyone who does so will help others in our community
> by commenting their configuration files appropriately perhaps with a
> #braille-friendly or #console-screen-reader-friendly or a
> #graphical-screen-reader-friendly tag.  This way we have a chance to build
> our capabilities and those that find these configuration files in the
> future.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list at redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>

mutt or alpine

[blinux-list]

There was and maybe still is a website called dotfiles.org.  It had
configuration files on it for various programs people found useful.  If
the website still exists the linux blindness lists might be able to
contribute to it but anyone who does so will help others in our community
by commenting their configuration files appropriately perhaps with a
#braille-friendly or #console-screen-reader-friendly or a
#graphical-screen-reader-friendly tag.  This way we have a chance to build
our capabilities and those that find these configuration files in the
future.