From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from befuddled.reisers.ca (befuddled.reisers.ca [206.248.184.127]) by hurricane.the-brannons.com (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 3fd3ed72 for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 18:49:44 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: befuddled.reisers.ca; dkim=pass (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=suddenlink.net header.i=@suddenlink.net header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=dkim-001 header.b=Xvhb1Xg6; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by befuddled.reisers.ca (Postfix, from userid 65534) id E22923821A4; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 13:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from befuddled.reisers.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by befuddled.reisers.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0F773818ED for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 13:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by befuddled.reisers.ca (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 5AB773818FD; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 13:49:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from altprdrgo03.altice.prod.cloud.openwave.ai (altprdrgo03.altice.prod.cloud.openwave.ai [65.20.63.176]) by befuddled.reisers.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DBDDA3818EB for ; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 13:49:39 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=suddenlink.net; s=dkim-001; t=1737571779; bh=F8OdYiuTPQxxQ1nnlcMWyXTiIxGJfKDS4Mz+YVdnFt0=; h=From:To:Subject:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Date:Message-Id; b=Xvhb1Xg69p94d9Qe2YBNLSsZwQYjY4BB3gmsEr9B9zFH7Oe2KBKN+E5VGtAl4ODuu9LEXVCJVXjXfe8HQ6Bu/jRZJD3su3Eswfzk8E94R1UKeohYUkde7BbdXUs3Qb5FGrvYwXMq/gVpI5SJvk5ox0u9Sx0nU3PkNvTZt80sIh1nhu5Wj9Ge6IQkAKuybaFY5XFbtCY66quax0AhLfUBatJ2sL1NbeSAkSD6v1KOydh/VF2W5/KBXv1dq9ssDfBY33XIEdJlMviCFQFplLX7bmIbLeeK3DyWBKD1VXUhvkM6jgUPW3eTAdTjehni/2nYt37VrADKiOypI6qcr9TVYg== X-RG-VS-CS: clean X-RG-VS-SC: 0 X-RG-VS: Clean X-Originating-IP: [47.217.105.81] X-RG-Env-Sender: martin.m@suddenlink.net X-RG-Rigid: 678F9D79003D9CCD X-RazorGate-Vade: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeefuddrudejfedgvdegtdcutefuodetggdotefrodftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucetnffvkfevgfgfufdpggftfghnshhusghstghrihgsvgdpqfgfvfenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmnecujfgurhephffvufggtgesthdttddttddtvdenucfhrhhomhepfdforghrthhinhcuofgtvehorhhmihgtkhdfuceomhgrrhhtihhnrdhmsehsuhguuggvnhhlihhnkhdrnhgvtheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhephfektdektdeljedtvefhgfeuleeiveevffduieelieffueejteelledukeekhfeunecukfhppeegjedrvddujedruddthedrkedunecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehhvghlohepfigshegrghiipdhinhgvthepgeejrddvudejrddutdehrdekuddpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmrghrthhinhdrmhesshhuugguvghnlhhinhhkrdhnvghtpdhnsggprhgtphhtthhopedupdhrtghpthhtohepshhpvggrkhhupheslhhinhhugidqshhpvggrkhhuphdrohhrghdprghuthhhpghushgvrhepmhgrrhhtihhnrdhmsehsuhguuggvnhhlihhnkhdrnhgvthdpghgvohfkrfepfgfupdfovfetjfhoshhtpegrlhhtphhrughrghhotdef X-RazorGate-Vade-Verdict: clean 0 X-RazorGate-Vade-Classification: clean Received: from wb5agz (47.217.105.81) by altprdrgo03.altice.prod.cloud.openwave.ai (5.8.812) (authenticated as martin.m@suddenlink.net) id 678F9D79003D9CCD for speakup@linux-speakup.org; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 13:49:35 -0500 Received: from martin by wb5agz with local (Exim 4.96) (envelope-from ) id 1tafn8-000EhT-0P for speakup@linux-speakup.org; Wed, 22 Jan 2025 12:49:30 -0600 From: "Martin McCormick" To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." Subject: Good old Speakup X-BeenThere: speakup@linux-speakup.org Precedence: list List-Id: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <56509.1737571770.1@wb5agz.lan> Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2025 12:49:30 -0600 Message-Id: X-Bogosity: Ham, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000000, version=1.2.5 Those of us who use screen readers have things we particularly like about them and stuff we dislike and a lot of that is totally subjective which makes the job of programming them even harder than simply coding. I have used speakup or espeakup depending on the time period we are talking about since 2009 or thereabouts when I first got vinux to work and no longer had to use a MSDOS PC running kermit and feeding a hardware speech synthesizer so I know of what I speak. I have a good and fast PC running debian bookworm with orca and the speech is good under orca but I always have wanted to have a pure command-line instance of old-school speakup for use in command-line stuff such as programming in c++, perl and shell scripts, PIC assembler and system administrative tasks. There are at least 2 command line consoles that open text terminal windows on Control-Alt-F3 and Control-Alt-F4. They don't talk so I installed fenrir and now, they talk but it's not what I was hoping for. By pure accident/stupidity on my part, I once installed espeakup on here before finding out that that is not a good idea because espeakup is not a user-space application and uses kernel modules that might conflict with orca. I forgot about the installation and have used orca a lot with no trouble but when i installed fenrir and got pipewire reconfigured to work with it, I was rudely reminded of espeakup which was a sleeping giant and awoke. Both espeakup and fenrir would simultaneously speak screen output in the command consoles, each one at a different pitch and rate. It was kind of amusing for about 15 seconds and then frustrating because the babble of the 2 voices, both e-speak but at different settings, tended to obscure what each was saying. I worked on that issue on and off for a couple of days before another happy accident which clued me in on what happened. I pressed the PrintScreen button and one of the voices said, "You killed speakup." Pressing it again brought it back like normal. So now I knew it was espeakup and fenrir having the babble battle. I de-installed espeakup and fenrir now talks but it's not the same thing. If you set punctuations to some, one must do that in the configuration file, then restart the service. When you do that, the = sign is not one of the punctuation marks that is spoken, so much for programming. Also, for some odd reason, Control-J (newline) and Control-K cause the screenreader to say "," as in the comma punctuation even there are no commas on the screen as near as i can tell. That, alone drives me batty since it is confusing to say the least. I am not trying to talk trash about fenrir because it's a good idea and there are things I like about the interface but oh, how I would like to just experience speakup in those command consoles. It's easy to go through different punctuation levels and change speech rates on the fly plus, if one sets the punctuation to most, you do hear what one needs to hear and that is important when programming and doing administrative tasks. Any constructive ideas are appreciated. Since espeakup did try to run, I have thought about putting it back as it never bothered orca while it was installed and then removing fenrir since both were trying to work at the same time. Martin