From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from vms042pub.verizon.net ([206.46.252.42]) by speech.braille.uwo.ca with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1I3TMr-0001Jp-00 for ; Wed, 27 Jun 2007 04:59:17 -0400 Received: from ALBERTLC7SN0ZA ([68.163.238.66]) by vms042.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JKA00HCSEAP2LW4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> for speakup@braille.uwo.ca; Wed, 27 Jun 2007 03:59:15 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 05:00:37 -0400 From: "Albert E. Sten-Clanton" Subject: Re: Software speech opinions To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." Message-id: <003301c7b899$a1b047a0$6405a8c0@ALBERTLC7SN0ZA> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1896 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <20070625031627.GC32366@localhost.localdomain><013701c7b7a0$5b1dd2c0$b100a8c0@AveratecLaptop><20070626042409.GA25331@cm.nu><026001c7b7ac$7a18ebe0$b100a8c0@AveratecLaptop><047301c7b809$9b0d3920$4ba65c90@vv507j> <002d01c7b813$f27baf70$6405a8c0@ALBERTLC7SN0ZA> <06af01c7b81e$30ae08b0$4ba65c90@vv507j> X-BeenThere: speakup@braille.uwo.ca X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." List-Id: "Speakup is a screen review system for Linux." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 08:59:18 -0000 > >. In real life, a good majority of the people who use computers will = know=20 > >little or nothing about how to fix the problems that arise. Do you = really=20 > >propose that these people, such as my wife, have no business = complaining or=20 > >suggesting because they're not ultranerds? >=20 > Well, sort of, yeah. Pointing out problems is one thing. Complaining = is=20 > another. And telling other people what they should do to solve your = problems=20 > is yet another thing entirely. >=20 I know there are good and bad ways of "pointing out problems," which is = why I mentioned treating people right when you do it. I hope I = generally do. =20 As for "telling other people what they should do to solve your = problems," that's about what I'd expect of any constructive user of any = product to do if he or she didn't create the product--for that matter, = whether it's "free" or not. To me, the question is not whether you = should do it, but how. > But anyway, my main point was to suggest that people ask themselves = what=20 > they've contributed to the open source community. Even if you're not a = > coder, you can write documentation, maintain a web site, etc. >=20 This is certainly a fair point. I'd add only that you can't be expected = to contribute in those ways until you know what you're doing. I've = learned the hard way that bad documentation sometimes is worse than none = at all, for example. In any event, my impression is that those who made = suggestions or complaints on the relevant topics here are already givers = as well as takers. Somebody else suggested giving money to the free software movement. = That also seems a good idea, though I don't know to whom I'd donate for = the purpose of, say, getting Speakup or similar non-visual access into = the vanilla kernel as a standard feature (assuming it can be done). Al