From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx01.intmail.prod.int.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.11.11]) by lists01.pubmisc.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id v522CEj9000394 for ; Thu, 1 Jun 2017 22:12:14 -0400 Received: by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) id 0CD177DB45; Fri, 2 Jun 2017 02:12:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mx1.redhat.com (ext-mx10.extmail.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com [10.5.110.39]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06A7B7D969 for ; Fri, 2 Jun 2017 02:12:12 +0000 (UTC) Received: from server2.shellworld.net (server2.shellworld.net [66.172.12.120]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 09A6A5F742 for ; Fri, 2 Jun 2017 02:12:10 +0000 (UTC) DMARC-Filter: OpenDMARC Filter v1.3.2 mx1.redhat.com 09A6A5F742 Authentication-Results: ext-mx10.extmail.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=shellworld.net Authentication-Results: ext-mx10.extmail.prod.ext.phx2.redhat.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=klewellen@shellworld.net DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 mx1.redhat.com 09A6A5F742 Received: by server2.shellworld.net (Postfix, from userid 1005) id 8C2E08C04E0; Fri, 2 Jun 2017 02:12:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by server2.shellworld.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81E848C0349 for ; Thu, 1 Jun 2017 22:12:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2017 22:12:09 -0400 (EDT) To: Linux for blind general discussion Subject: Re: living in the console. In-Reply-To: <20170601184415.786f5048@bigbox.christie.dr> Message-ID: References: <20170525181847.50b1a16c@bigbox.christie.dr> <5ED6A047-C99B-479C-819B-533A9B3900E4@BlueMail.com> <0BA3D3CA-0D4F-4C93-BBB6-0CE4BC9DCB29@gmail.com> <20170601205645.GA6607@panix.com> <20170601184415.786f5048@bigbox.christie.dr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.5.16 (mx1.redhat.com [10.5.110.39]); Fri, 02 Jun 2017 02:12:10 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: inspected by milter-greylist-4.5.16 (mx1.redhat.com [10.5.110.39]); Fri, 02 Jun 2017 02:12:10 +0000 (UTC) for IP:'66.172.12.120' DOMAIN:'server2.shellworld.net' HELO:'server2.shellworld.net' FROM:'klewellen@shellworld.net' RCPT:'' X-RedHat-Spam-Score: 3.699 *** (BAYES_99, BAYES_999, RP_MATCHES_RCVD) 66.172.12.120 server2.shellworld.net 66.172.12.120 server2.shellworld.net X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.78 on 10.5.110.39 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.79 on 10.5.11.11 X-loop: blinux-list@redhat.com From: Linux for blind general discussion X-BeenThere: blinux-list@redhat.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: junk Reply-To: blinux-list@redhat.com List-Id: Linux for blind general discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2017 02:12:14 -0000 Actually, This claim is not true or at least not entirely. While freedos is indeed currently developed, there are many pure dos things that present issues. I have been on the freedos list for a number of years, one reason why I do not use freedos myself is the risks involved with blending traditional sources of dos programs with freedos. Further, unless they incorporated a different USB driver, the one included is not full proof. Granted those doing the steps you desire can suggest for themselves. Still I run a package of ms dos 7.1 which has utilities from 2005 or so. additionally I have a USB dos driver written by Panasonic which does far more than the USB one included with freedos. the package installs from a cd, although you can create floppies if you desire. A great deal depends on your hardware, I have my computers built, the one I am using now is a p3 with about 780 meg of memory, but I have used dos successfully since 1988. I am looking forward to learning which DOS editions other members are using. I still have a copy of telix myself smiles. Karen On Thu, 1 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote: > Tim here. The FreeDOS folks just released version 1.2 earlier this > year > > http://www.freedos.org/download/ > > which is available for free and has multiple installation-media > images (ISOs to burn a CD along with a boot-floppy image if your > machine is so old that it won't boot to a CD, as well as a disk-image > files to write to a USB disk) > > It's actively developed and should run pretty much any DOS > application that you throw at it. > > -tim > > On June 1, 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote: >> Ok, this dos discussion makes me wanna run dos. Coolness! >> How can i get it? >> >> >> Mark Peveto >> Registered Linux user number 600552 >> Everything happens after coffee! >> >> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote: >> >>> The solution I've been using for years is to use my DOS machine >>> running Telix, a vt100 terminal emulator and Vocal Eyes screen >>> reader. >>> >>> Then I just connect to my local linux box using a null modem >>> cable and from there run screen for multiple consoles. >>> >>> Linux does all the heavy lifting including mplayer, lynx, ssh to >>> remote accounts etc. >>> >>> The best part of this mode of operation is that all linux >>> consoles feel the same. Regardless whether they are on my local >>> box, on my Panix shell account, or on a remote work server. >>> >>> And as was pointed out, I can control all the speech controls >>> from my main keyboard. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Jun 01, 2017 at 04:02:42PM -0400, Linux for blind general >>> discussion wrote: >>>> If two local computers are available with one running dos and a >>>> compatible screen reader and a user is willing and able to work >>>> in the console it's possible with a null modem cable and a >>>> program like kermit or commo on the dos machine to connect to >>>> the other computer running linux and have all console output >>>> redirected out the linux serial port to the dos box. I did >>>> this once with only one version of linux and the information on >>>> how to do that is in one of linux-howtos serial howto files. >>>> >>>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote: >>>> >>>>> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2017 14:03:36 >>>>> From: Linux for blind general discussion >>>>> To: Linux for blind general >>>>> discussion Subject: Re: living in >>>>> the console. >>>>> >>>>> I am not. >>>>> since none of the Linux speech sources currently support my >>>>> synthesizer, it is not like I can just buy a system. >>>>> That means having one built and configured locally..something >>>>> I did not think would be such an issue. I mean I do it >>>>> regularly for DOS when I find a later edition of DOS that >>>>> gives me something needful. My present dos package for >>>>> example is only a few years old comparatively speaking, has >>>>> full USB support, networking etc. However I have been trying >>>>> to find local talent for the Linux side for more than a >>>>> decade now, almost 15 years or so I imagine. >>>>> User groups tend to have a laid back perspective if they can >>>>> be found. clear, fundamental and step by step information in >>>>> basic but informative detail does not exist, let alone in >>>>> person training. >>>>> >>>>> I even had someone try to install Linux to a drive and send >>>>> it, only not to have Linux support any of the hand picked >>>>> hardware, or for that person to have included any way to >>>>> reach the internet...I am serious. I would ssh telnet into >>>>> the box just like I do for Shellworld which is now running >>>>> Ubuntu 16.04, or my dreamhost setup for work which is not as >>>>> current. I have no problem doing that at all, but the box >>>>> must exist setup to my specifications, I intend using it for >>>>> music making and media..which means in person real skill. >>>>> long distance has simply produced amusing efforts with no >>>>> progress. My favorite local effort was when someone building >>>>> a machine for me showed up with a live disk prepared to >>>>> introduce me to Linux. They popped in the cd and we >>>>> waited...and waited...and waited lol! >>>>> >>>>> besides, I think speekup still puts all the controls on one >>>>> side of the keyboard, not using the full thing, which for me >>>>> personally is counter productive. >>>>> My present screen readers, all of the ones on my machine >>>>> actually, let me get information without ever taking my hands >>>>> off the keys unless I need to review. >>>>> Most important though since all software speech makes me >>>>> dizzy is the need to keep the voice I have with whatever I am >>>>> using. Long answer to as short comment, >>>>> Kare >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> If you're in the market for a linux laptop, >>>>>> http://www.thinkpenguin.com/ is one good source. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2017 09:57:30 >>>>>>> From: Linux for blind general discussion >>>>>>> To: Linux for blind general >>>>>>> discussion Subject: Re: living >>>>>>> in the console. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> which is why I am going to find one on line somewhere. >>>>>>> I have no actual Linux box myself. >>>>>>> Kare >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, 31 May 2017, Linux for blind general discussion >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Oh I think there is a file somewhere called setup.exe >>>>>>>> or >>>>>>> edbrowse-setup > or something like that. >>>>>>>> Sorry it has been many years since I did the setup. >>>>>>>> The readme file will tell you all about it. >>>>>>>>>> On May 31, 2017, at 10:26 PM, Linux for blind >>>>>>>>>> general >>>>>>> discussion > wrote: >>>>>>>>> Well it must require more because when I tried >>>>>>>>> visiting >>>>>>> paypal I just > got a series of numbers and a blank >>>>>>> page. >>>>>>>> Even trying for a help menu produced the question, are >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>> looking for > business solutions? >>>>>>>> Granted we may not have it fully configured here at >>>>>>>> shellworld. Will hunt some sort of manual and try again, >>>>>>>> Kare >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 31 May 2017, Linux for blind general >>>>>>>>>>> discussion wrote: If you mean to browse something >>>>>>>>>>> just type: edbrowse url >>>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>>> edbrowse file >>>>>>>>>>> Then you can use the same commands as ed. >>>>>>>>>>> edbrowse is also an email reader/sender and other >>>>>>> stuff. I love it. >>>>>>>>>>>>> On May 30, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Linux for blind >>>>>>> general discussion > > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Out of curiosity, what is the syntax for ebrowse? >>>>>>>>> We have it here at shellworld...I think, and I wish >>>>>>>>> to test >>>>>>> something. >>>>>>>>> Karen >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 26 May 2017, Linux for blind >>>>>>>>>>>>>> general >>>>>>> discussion wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Edbrowse may help for web browsing alonggg >>>>>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>> surfraw-heavy. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent from BlueMail for iPhone >>>>>>>>>> On May 25, 2017 at 7:18 PM, Linux for blind general >>>>>>> discussion > > > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Tim here >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark Peveto wrote >>>>>>>>>> Over the last couple days or so, I've considered >>>>>>>>>> becoming a totally command line linux user. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm mostly there. Web browsing is the big >>>>>>>>>>>>> hurdle >>>>>>> for much of my >>>>>>>>>> day-to-day use. Lynx/links/elinks work for many >>>>>>>>>> things, but some sites just need a fully >>>>>>>>>> modern-standards-supporting browser. >>>>>>>>>>>>> How would I print to my printer for example, >>>>>>>>>>>>> It depends on what you want to print, but it >>>>>>> usually involves piping >>>>>>>>>> things to the "lp" ("line printer") program. It >>>>>>>>>> can be >>>>>>> configured to >>>>>>>>>> use CUPS on the back end (and may already be >>>>>>>>>> configured out of the box for you). >>>>>>>>>>>>> Getting fancier output would involve >>>>>>>>>>>>> rendering some >>>>>>> sort of markup. >>>>>>>>>> There are tools to render HTML, LaTeX, PDFs, and >>>>>>>>>> even > > >>>>>>>> Word/LibreOffice >>>>>>>>>> docs from the command-line to the printer. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know what you want to print, but I >>>>>>>>>>>>> suspect >>>>>>> it can be done in >>>>>>>>>> most cases. >>>>>>>>>>>>> play an entire album from my music >>>>>>>>>>>>> collection. It depends on your tastes, but >>>>>>>>>>>>> there are literally >>>>>>> dozens of music >>>>>>>>>> players. Some, such as mpg123/mpg312/aplay/ogg123 >>>>>>>>>> allow you to specify just the files you want on the >>>>>>>>>> command line and >>>>>>> it will play >>>>>>>>>> them. Others, like mplayer are similar but give >>>>>>>>>> you a little more control over playback. >>>>>>>>>>>>> There's also mpd/mpc which is the Music >>>>>>>>>>>>> Player >>>>>>> Daemon/Client that >>>>>>>>>> runs in the background and doesn't really have a >>>>>>>>>> GUI. The mpd program runs in the background and the >>>>>>>>>> mpc program acts like a remote-control, letting you >>>>>>>>>> create/edit playlists, >>>>>>> control playback, >>>>>>>>>> etc. I like the remote-control aspect as I can map >>>>>>>>>> them to particular keys on my keyboard or aliases >>>>>>>>>> in the shell >>>>>>> and have > > > quick >>>>>>>>>> access to common commands with my media-keys. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I use "cmus" which has a >>>>>>>>>>>>> text-mode GUI >>>>>>> but also has a >>>>>>>>>> remote-control interface like mpd/mpc. I start up >>>>>>>>>> tmux and have a pane for my alsamixer and cmus >>>>>>>>>> which lets me flip between >>>>>>> them > > > pretty >>>>>>>>>> readily. It allows me to make play-lists, search >>>>>>>>>> my collection, shuffle, etc, much like you'd be >>>>>>>>>> familiar with in a >>>>>>> graphical > > > player. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How, also, would I create documents in >>>>>>> something beyond text >>>>>>>>>> format? >>>>>>>>>>>>> usually it's done with a markup that suits >>>>>>>>>>>>> your >>>>>>> tastes. I personally >>>>>>>>>> have been writing HTML by hand since college in >>>>>>>>>> the mid >>>>>>> 90s so > > > that's >>>>>>>>>> what I reach for. But other people like TeX/LaTeX >>>>>>>>>> (it does produce some beautiful output and also has >>>>>>>>>> external library >>>>>>> support for > > > things >>>>>>>>>> like music markup letting you write scores) while >>>>>>>>>> other people like some of the more light-weight >>>>>>>>>> markup languages like Markdown or RST or the like. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd kick the tires on a few and see what >>>>>>>>>>>>> feels >>>>>>> natural to you. >>>>>>>>>> Fortunately, there's a tool called "pandoc" that >>>>>>>>>> lets you convert between a large number of >>>>>>>>>> input/output formats so you can write in Markdown >>>>>>>>>> and convert to PDF, or write in HTML and convert >>>>>>> to MS-Word >>>>>>>>>> format, or write in LaTeX and convert to ePub with >>>>>>> minimal loss. And >>>>>>>>>> it outputs any of them in plain-text (though you >>>>>>>>>> may lose some information in the process since >>>>>>>>>> plain-text doesn't support many features as you've >>>>>>>>>> acknowledged) >>>>>>>>>>>>> How does one ditch the guy, and still enjoy >>>>>>>>>>>>> all >>>>>>> linux has to offer >>>>>>>>>> in the console? >>>>>>>>>>>>> One program at a time (grins). So much like >>>>>>>>>>>>> each of >>>>>>> the items above, >>>>>>>>>> it's a matter of asking "I currently do XYZ in the >>>>>>>>>> GUI >>>>>>> but would > > > like >>>>>>>>>> to do XYZ in the console" for whatever XYZ is your >>>>>>>>>> next adventure. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I maintain a page listing a number of common >>>>>>> command-line tools: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://tim.thechases.com/posts/cli/software-for-a-command-line-world/ >>>>>>>>>>>>> that can point you in the direction of >>>>>>>>>>>>> various >>>>>>> applications to try >>>>>>>>>> out. Some might drive you crazy while others might >>>>>>>>>> fit your brain just right. They should all be free >>>>>>>>>> and are likely in most software repos, so it >>>>>>>>>> doesn't cost you anything except a little time to >>>>>>>>>> try each one out. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm willing to learn how to do this, but who >>>>>>>>>>>>> ever >>>>>>> decides to help >>>>>>>>>> me is gonna hafta be patient. >>>>>>>>>>>>> The folks on this list are a pretty friendly >>>>>>>>>>>>> & >>>>>>> patient bunch, so >>>>>>>>>> we'll be glad to help where we can. >>>>>>>>>>>>> -tim >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Blinux-list mailing list >>>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>> >>> -- >>> Rudy Vener >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Blinux-list mailing list >>> Blinux-list@redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Blinux-list mailing list >> Blinux-list@redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list > > _______________________________________________ > Blinux-list mailing list > Blinux-list@redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list > >