Comparing Brltty and Suse

Comparing Brltty and Suse

[John J. Boyer]

Hello,
Ok. So let's have a comparison of brltty and suse from people who have 
tried both. I have never had to set attributes for a particular program, 
so I wondeer if this feature is really very useful.
John


-- 
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Nath]

Hello,

To have an idea, try to use MC (Midnight  Commander) with BRLTTY and with
Suse-blinux. I don't know if there is a lot of applications like this but
it's an example to demonstrate that sometime you must set attributes in
order to use a particular application.

--
Nath

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 26/06/02 at 08:21 John J. Boyer wrote:

>Hello,
>Ok. So let's have a comparison of brltty and suse from people who have 
>tried both. I have never had to set attributes for a particular program, 
>so I wondeer if this feature is really very useful.
>John
>
>
>-- 
>Computers to Help People, Inc.
>http://www.chpi.org
>825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Blinux-list mailing list
>Blinux-list@redhat.com
>https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list



 
______________________________________________________________________________
ifrance.com, l'email gratuit le plus complet de l'Internet !
vos emails depuis un navigateur, en POP3, sur Minitel, sur le WAP...
http://www.ifrance.com/_reloc/email.emailif

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Christian Schoepplein]

Hello!

On Mit, Jun 26, 2002 at 08:21:35 -0500, John J. Boyer wrote:
> Ok. So let's have a comparison of brltty and suse from people who have 
> tried both. I have never had to set attributes for a particular program, 
> so I wondeer if this feature is really very useful.
> John

I Think this feature is very usefull! Rreading out the attributes of a 
screen and pipe them into programm that can handel them and react 
in some way brings up a higher flexibility. Suse-Blinux reads out for 
example the color or a underlined part on the screen and in a profile you 
can tell the screenreader, what to do with this things. That makes it very 
easy to work with programms like mc or the configurationstool of SuSE 
called yast2, you can underline links in a browser or take a look at a 
statusline and when it changes it comes up on the brailledisplay. 
Attributes are also good for the speechoutput. Only the "interesting" 
things on the screen are outputet of the speechsynth.

Best regards,
Schoeppi

-- 
Christian Schoepplein    | http://www.lily-rockt.de
mail@schoeppi.net        | http://www.lavish.de

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[John J. Boyer]

Schoeppi, 
This sounds interesting. Brltty also has the capability to read out 
attributes, but I've never used it. Brltty also has some support for 
speech, and it will get better in the future.
John
On Wed, 26 Jun 2002, 
Christian Schoepplein wrote:

> Hello!
> 
> On Mit, Jun 26, 2002 at 08:21:35 -0500, John J. Boyer wrote:
> > Ok. So let's have a comparison of brltty and suse from people who have 
> > tried both. I have never had to set attributes for a particular program, 
> > so I wondeer if this feature is really very useful.
> > John
> 
> I Think this feature is very usefull! Rreading out the attributes of a 
> screen and pipe them into programm that can handel them and react 
> in some way brings up a higher flexibility. Suse-Blinux reads out for 
> example the color or a underlined part on the screen and in a profile you 
> can tell the screenreader, what to do with this things. That makes it very 
> easy to work with programms like mc or the configurationstool of SuSE 
> called yast2, you can underline links in a browser or take a look at a 
> statusline and when it changes it comes up on the brailledisplay. 
> Attributes are also good for the speechoutput. Only the "interesting" 
> things on the screen are outputet of the speechsynth.
> 
> Best regards,
> Schoeppi
> 
> 

-- 
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Mario Lang]

"Nath" <nath31@ifrance.com> writes:

> To have an idea, try to use MC (Midnight  Commander) with BRLTTY and with
> Suse-blinux. I don't know if there is a lot of applications like this but
> it's an example to demonstrate that sometime you must set attributes in
> order to use a particular application.

I use mc with brltty regularly, and I don't have any problem.

mc presents the currently selected file in the bottom line of each
split window.  So I dont need attributes.

And the main menu and the dialog boxes all use the normal cursor
to position correctly.

There is a option in mc to enable this "statusline", but I forgot how it was
called.  I can look it up if you are interested.

-- 
CYa,
  Mario

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Boris DAIX]

Mario Lang <mlang@teleweb.at> writes:

> "Nath" <nath31@ifrance.com> writes:
>
> I use mc with brltty regularly, and I don't have any problem.

Hi Mario :-) (you may remember my newbe question few weeks ago)

I feel like mc is really unconfortable to scroll, there are lots of
what I would call "garbage characters" (e.g. vert. and
horiz. lines). I use emacs/dired for managing files, and felt very
happy as BRLTTY works fine with emacs.

> mc presents the currently selected file in the bottom line of each
> split window.  So I dont need attributes.

Sometimes file names are cut with ? between beginning and the end of
the name, preventing recognizing similar file names. Is there a way to
avoid this ? (I really can't think how)

> And the main menu and the dialog boxes all use the normal cursor
> to position correctly.

Ok - I personnaly can't stand menus... :-) (personnal feelings)

> There is a option in mc to enable this "statusline", but I forgot how it was
> called.  I can look it up if you are interested.

I won't help here.

But, talking about BRLTTY features, are there generic filters to help
working on one program or another ?

Regards,

Boris

P.S.: I use BRLTTY with VisioBraille support and had to rebuild the
.deb because the config step broke down. Soon, when I'll be able to
understand Debian packages, I'll try to help about this.

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Dave Mielke]

[quoted lines by Boris DAIX on June 26, 2002, at 21:51]

>But, talking about BRLTTY features, are there generic filters to help
>working on one program or another ?

BRLTTY has nothing one would call a filter. Tell me what needs to be
implemented, and we'll certainly look into it.

-- 
Dave Mielke           | 2213 Fox Crescent | I believe that the Bible is the
Phone: 1-613-726-0014 | Ottawa, Ontario   | Word of God. Please contact me
EMail: dave@mielke.cc | Canada  K2A 1H7   | if you're concerned about Hell.
http://familyradio.com

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Nath]

Hi Mario & all,

Yes, I'm interrested . then if you can search this option for me ?
and another question : is it possible for blind people using BRLTTY  to
select more than one file at the same time with MC ? I ask you because this
possibility will be very interresting in order to copy or cut and paste
files.
Thanks.

--
Nath

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 26/06/02 at 21:14 Mario Lang wrote:

>"Nath" <nath31@ifrance.com> writes:
>
>> To have an idea, try to use MC (Midnight  Commander) with BRLTTY and
with
>> Suse-blinux. I don't know if there is a lot of applications like this
but
>> it's an example to demonstrate that sometime you must set attributes in
>> order to use a particular application.
>
>I use mc with brltty regularly, and I don't have any problem.
>
>mc presents the currently selected file in the bottom line of each
>split window.  So I dont need attributes.
>
>And the main menu and the dialog boxes all use the normal cursor
>to position correctly.
>
>There is a option in mc to enable this "statusline", but I forgot how it
>was
>called.  I can look it up if you are interested.
>
>-- 
>CYa,
>  Mario
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Blinux-list mailing list
>Blinux-list@redhat.com
>https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list



 
______________________________________________________________________________
ifrance.com, l'email gratuit le plus complet de l'Internet !
vos emails depuis un navigateur, en POP3, sur Minitel, sur le WAP...
http://www.ifrance.com/_reloc/email.emailif

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Boris DAIX]

Dave Mielke <dave@mielke.cc> writes:

> BRLTTY has nothing one would call a filter. Tell me what needs to be
> implemented, and we'll certainly look into it.

Thank you for your interest. I may be far from BRLTTY purpose, as I'm
a new (and happy !) user, but would it be possible to recognize a
modeline in emacs so that we can easily jump from one window to
another (to read them) ? (GNU Emacs), because we often open a secondary window
(i.e. completion) and have to scroll "a lot" to find bottom one. In
fact, my question is "would it be possible to sectorize tty with some
pattern-matching to be faster while browsing it ?".
I have to say that, for the moment, I use a 20-sized
brailledisplay... So I scroll a lot :-) Another example would be to
split MC screen for reading (two vertical sectors, a third at the
bottom) so that it helps finding things.

This may not be a good idea as we would have to find a way to
recognize screens (MC, centericq, emacs and so on), and
pattern-matching would be hazardous sometimes (it wouldn't be built on
semantics, only appearence), but it gives an idea of what kinds of
screen-viewers could feature.

Tell me what you think about

Regards, Boris.

P.S. : I've used screen sectorizing tools under Windows and I know it wasn't
a good way to help as when you just move one thing, all goes wrong...

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Mario Lang]

"Nath" <nath31@ifrance.com> writes:

> Yes, I'm interrested . then if you can search this option for me ?
Go into the main menu (F9),
go to Options,
go to Layout,
there, check the option "show Mini status"

> and another question : is it possible for blind people using BRLTTY  to
> select more than one file at the same time with MC ?

I dont use that, I use zsh for all my globbing needs.
mc is just a nice tool to browse a directory very fast.

> I ask you because this possibility will be very interresting in
> order to copy or cut and paste files. 
My suggestion is:
Get familiar with UNIX shells.

cp inf*2-1.5*deb /some/where

is much faster than finding all the files, marking them, and copying them (in mc)

Or even, get familiar with zsh, then you can throw away find and such
completely and do spiffy stuff like:

ls -l /**/my-file*

which lists all files on your file-sytem which match my-file*


-- 
CYa,
  Mario

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Mario Lang]

Boris DAIX <Boris.Daix@insa-lyon.fr> writes:

> Mario Lang <mlang@teleweb.at> writes:
>
>> "Nath" <nath31@ifrance.com> writes:
>>
>> I use mc with brltty regularly, and I don't have any problem.
>
> I feel like mc is really unconfortable to scroll, there are lots of
> what I would call "garbage characters" (e.g. vert. and
> horiz. lines). I use emacs/dired for managing files, and felt very
> happy as BRLTTY works fine with emacs.
I totally agree.  I didnt manage to switch to dired completely yet,
as some of it is a bit strange to me.
mc is really just a "fast look trough" tool for me.


>> mc presents the currently selected file in the bottom line of each
>> split window.  So I dont need attributes.
>
> Sometimes file names are cut with ? between beginning and the end of
> the name, preventing recognizing similar file names. Is there a way to
> avoid this ?

No, of course not.
You can always so ls begin*, where begin is the beginning of the filename
you see, to get the whole name.


-- 
CYa,
  Mario

Re: Comparing Brltty and Suse

[Boris DAIX]

Mario Lang <mlang@teleweb.at> writes:

> Boris DAIX <Boris.Daix@insa-lyon.fr> writes:
>
[..]
>
>>> mc presents the currently selected file in the bottom line of each
>>> split window.  So I dont need attributes.
>>
>> Sometimes file names are cut with ? between beginning and the end of
>> the name, preventing recognizing similar file names. Is there a way to
>> avoid this ?
>
> No, of course not.
> You can always so ls begin*, where begin is the beginning of the filename
> you see, to get the whole name.

Ok -:)

I didn't know anything about zsh, and it seams to be interesting
doesn't it ? I'll try soon.

Regards, Boris