talking handheld

talking handheld

[rick watson]

Hi Everyone,

I am comfortable using linux on a server. I have installed the speakup
package.

After briefly looking at the blinux archive, it appears that some of you are
experimenting with handheld devices.

I am interested in getting a handheld which talks. Could you please provide
experiences. I realize that this will most likely involve installing
software. This should be no problem. I want to have some good ideas before I
invest money in a handheld.



Good or BAD experiences are welcome!!

thanks

Rick

Re: talking handheld

[Rafael Skodlar,,,]

I bought Sharp Zaurus PDA device at last Linux world expo in San
Francisco. I'm very pleased with it and it's the most promising PDA in
my opinion. Briefly, it has 64 MB of main memory, CF port, memory stick
port, cradle port, sound input and output, tiny keyboard, and infrared
port. Cradle port can be used for serial or USB type of connections.

I haven't used sound on it yet but it's possible to play mp3 files which
makes me think that one should be able to install software that
generates sound output. It's possible to use audio input from microphone
or whatever other source to record into file. Sound output works with
headphones and can be connected to amplifier with speakers. Sound demo
at the tradeshow was impressive.

Besides original OS, one can overwrite it with openZaurus, which
excludes commercial software like Opera (web browser) and office tools.
Open source of course provides many of the tools we enjoy in other
versions of Linux or Unix.

I downloaded programs like console which gives me access to bash and
other GNU tools. Having wireless card inserted in CF port (compact flash
memory) I can connect to wireless network to get email, browse the
internet, etc. I haven't tried lynx yeat but have no dubt it works as
expected. Another important tool I use is openssh.

Backups are simple, Zaurus creates tar file on CF card that can be dealt
with on any Linux desktop. Files can easily be transfered between the
machines using CF card. I haven't tried memory stick yet but assume it
works just like CF does.

In short, I recommend Sharp's Zaurus for it's flexibility, support for
open source, and computing power. It's graphical part of software could
be removed to gain memory space for the blind specific tools. Perhaps
some kind of speech generating software could be installed on it. Ever
growing density of CF memory makes it possible to keep bigger and bigger
files in PDAs. If I come across anything like that I'll let you know.

I keep a list of Zaurus related links on
http://www.linwin.com/zaurus/index.html

Rafael

On Fri, Aug 23, 2002 at 08:17:13AM -0400, rick watson wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I am comfortable using linux on a server. I have installed the speakup
> package.
> 
> After briefly looking at the blinux archive, it appears that some of you are
> experimenting with handheld devices.
> 
> I am interested in getting a handheld which talks. Could you please provide
> experiences. I realize that this will most likely involve installing
> software. This should be no problem. I want to have some good ideas before I
> invest money in a handheld.
> 
> 
> 
> Good or BAD experiences are welcome!!
> 
> thanks
> 
> Rick

Re: talking handheld

[Dave Hunt <]

I wonder if you could put emacspeak or yasr on this device, using
EFlite for speech synthesis?  You might have to cross-compile for the
strong arm chip.


-Dave

Rafael Skodlar,,, writes:
 > I bought Sharp Zaurus PDA device at last Linux world expo in San
 > Francisco. I'm very pleased with it and it's the most promising PDA in
 > my opinion.

...

Re: talking handheld

[Mario Lang]

"Dave Hunt <" <dave.hunt2@verizon.net> writes:

> I wonder if you could put emacspeak or yasr on this device, using
> EFlite for speech synthesis?
YASR maybe, emacspeak is too big I think
(emacs+emacspeak is alot of stuff)

> You might have to cross-compile for the strong arm chip.
Debian offers a ARM version of eflite, check
ftp://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/e/eflite/


-- 
CYa,
  Mario

Re: talking handheld

[Mario Lang]

rick watson <rick@oglevee.com> writes:

> I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the pacmate is
> over 2000 dollars.
> This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.
What did you expect from an Assistive technology company?

IMO, the only good approach is to figure out which
currently available PDA hardware works nice with linux,
and set the thing up with free software.
I wouldnt pay a AT company $2000 for a device
they built for $300 (or even less).


-- 
CYa,
  Mario

Re: talking handheld

[Jude DaShiell]

Interesting, I'll save the link.  If a user defineable data base and an
improved calculator ever get added to that organizer and I have the funds
when I find out I'll buy it.  Not enough functions on calculator for the
kinds of things I like to play with and I'm not sure the calculator is
programmable either.  The other thing about the data base is some of us
like to define our own field names and be able to store info as we figure
it out for later transfer to a computer.  One of the kinds of calculations
I do requires trig functions and for me can be pretty useful.  As things
stand I have that working on one computer in a program I wrote in Power C.

x

On Sat, 24 Aug 2002, David Poehlman wrote:

> there are going to be more expensive offerings out there but you can
> also get the voice mate from:
> http://www.aagi.com
> or me.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marshall F. Scott" <scott@cvrti.utah.edu>
> To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:55 PM
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>
>
> Hi,
> Until text to speech is included in more consumer products; these things
> will
> always be expensive.   Have you checked out the Parrot Voicemate?  I
> think the
> URL is <http://voice-assistant.com>
> Marshall
> --
> Marshall F. Scott
> University of Utah
> CVRTI
> 95 South 2000 East
> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>
> ----------
> >From: rick watson <rick@oglevee.com>
> >To: "'blinux-list@redhat.com'" <blinux-list@redhat.com>
> >Subject: RE: talking handheld
> >Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 12:23 PM
> >
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the
> pacmate is
> > over 2000 dollars.
> > This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.
> >
> > I am a jaws user and love the program.
> > so this isn't a message to bash fs.
> >
> > rick
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
> > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
> > To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> > Subject: Re: talking handheld
> >
> >
> > Hello,
> > Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
> > recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp
> business
> > practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
> > refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
> > money I paid for the contract.
> > John
> > On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some
> information on
> > this
> >> machine.
> >> Marshall>
> >> --
> >> Marshall F. Scott
> >> University of Utah
> >> CVRTI
> >> 95 South 2000 East
> >> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> >> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> >> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> >> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
> >>
> >> ----------
> >> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
> >> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> >> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> >> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
> >>
> >>
> >> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
> > speech
> >> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
> > wirelessly
> >> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose
> to
> > make a
> >> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
> > Suppose to
> >> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
> >>
> >> Jeff
> >>
> >> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
> >> Richmond, Va
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Computers to Help People, Inc.
> > http://www.chpi.org
> > 825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list@redhat.com
> > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list@redhat.com
> > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>

Re: talking handheld

[David Poehlman]

pac mate will have this.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Mail4cobb@aol.com>
To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2002 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: talking handheld


I want a P D A with speech. I want the IR ability to beam info and use 
applications I already use and am fimilar with. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 180 bytes --]

I want a P D A with speech. I want the IR ability to beam info and use 
applications I already use and am fimilar with. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 260 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 207 bytes --]

Sorry, I only know english and some spanish. I dont mind a touch screen if 
its like the palm works. I use their garaffitie language to input data.

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 287 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[David Poehlman]

management shake up they may have had but there seems to be no evidence
of this out in the field.  further to your issue.  I too have seen
individual cases with almost every company out there where someone had
problems of one kind or another.

----- Original Message -----
From: "John J. Boyer" <director@chpi.org>
To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Hello,
Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp business
practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
money I paid for the contract.
John
On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
wrote:

> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information
on this
> machine.
> Marshall>
> --
> Marshall F. Scott
> University of Utah
> CVRTI
> 95 South 2000 East
> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>
> ----------
> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
>
>
> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
speech
> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
wirelessly
> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose
to make a
> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
Suppose to
> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
>
> Jeff
>
> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
> Richmond, Va
>

--
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703




_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
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Re: talking handheld

[David Poehlman]

think pac mate is high?  look at voice note, braille note etc.  I would
not consider the pac mate to be a true hand held though although it
seems as though it will opperate like one because of its shear size.

----- Original Message -----
From: "rick watson" <rick@oglevee.com>
To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:23 PM
Subject: RE: talking handheld


Hi,

I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the pacmate
is
over 2000 dollars.
This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.

I am a jaws user and love the program.
so this isn't a message to bash fs.

rick

-----Original Message-----
From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
To: blinux-list@redhat.com
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Hello,
Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp business
practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
money I paid for the contract.
John
On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
wrote:

> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information
on
this
> machine.
> Marshall>
> --
> Marshall F. Scott
> University of Utah
> CVRTI
> 95 South 2000 East
> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>
> ----------
> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
>
>
> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
speech
> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
wirelessly
> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose
to
make a
> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
Suppose to
> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
>
> Jeff
>
> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
> Richmond, Va
>

--
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703




_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list



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Re: talking handheld

[David Poehlman]

sorry if this is a repeat, but I thinnk I sent it to the rong place.
you can also get the voice mate from:
http://www.aagi.com
or me.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Marshall F. Scott" <scott@cvrti.utah.edu>
To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:55 PM
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Hi,
Until text to speech is included in more consumer products; these things
will
always be expensive.   Have you checked out the Parrot Voicemate?  I
think the
URL is <http://voice-assistant.com>
Marshall
--
Marshall F. Scott
University of Utah
CVRTI
95 South 2000 East
Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
Voice: (801) 587-9523
FAX: (801) 581-3128
Cellular: (801) 232-5316

----------
>From: rick watson <rick@oglevee.com>
>To: "'blinux-list@redhat.com'" <blinux-list@redhat.com>
>Subject: RE: talking handheld
>Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 12:23 PM
>

> Hi,
>
> I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the
pacmate is
> over 2000 dollars.
> This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.
>
> I am a jaws user and love the program.
> so this isn't a message to bash fs.
>
> rick
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>
>
> Hello,
> Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
> recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp
business
> practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
> refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
> money I paid for the contract.
> John
> On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
> wrote:
>
>> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some
information on
> this
>> machine.
>> Marshall>
>> --
>> Marshall F. Scott
>> University of Utah
>> CVRTI
>> 95 South 2000 East
>> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
>> Voice: (801) 587-9523
>> FAX: (801) 581-3128
>> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>>
>> ----------
>> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
>> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
>> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
>>
>>
>> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
> speech
>> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
> wirelessly
>> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose
to
> make a
>> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
> Suppose to
>> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
>> Richmond, Va
>>
>
> --
> Computers to Help People, Inc.
> http://www.chpi.org
> 825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list



_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
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Re: talking handheld

[David Poehlman]

there are going to be more expensive offerings out there but you can
also get the voice mate from:
http://www.aagi.com
or me.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Marshall F. Scott" <scott@cvrti.utah.edu>
To: <blinux-list@redhat.com>
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:55 PM
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Hi,
Until text to speech is included in more consumer products; these things
will
always be expensive.   Have you checked out the Parrot Voicemate?  I
think the
URL is <http://voice-assistant.com>
Marshall
--
Marshall F. Scott
University of Utah
CVRTI
95 South 2000 East
Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
Voice: (801) 587-9523
FAX: (801) 581-3128
Cellular: (801) 232-5316

----------
>From: rick watson <rick@oglevee.com>
>To: "'blinux-list@redhat.com'" <blinux-list@redhat.com>
>Subject: RE: talking handheld
>Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 12:23 PM
>

> Hi,
>
> I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the
pacmate is
> over 2000 dollars.
> This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.
>
> I am a jaws user and love the program.
> so this isn't a message to bash fs.
>
> rick
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>
>
> Hello,
> Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
> recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp
business
> practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
> refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
> money I paid for the contract.
> John
> On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
> wrote:
>
>> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some
information on
> this
>> machine.
>> Marshall>
>> --
>> Marshall F. Scott
>> University of Utah
>> CVRTI
>> 95 South 2000 East
>> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
>> Voice: (801) 587-9523
>> FAX: (801) 581-3128
>> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>>
>> ----------
>> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
>> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
>> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
>>
>>
>> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
> speech
>> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
> wirelessly
>> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose
to
> make a
>> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
> Suppose to
>> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
>> Richmond, Va
>>
>
> --
> Computers to Help People, Inc.
> http://www.chpi.org
> 825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list



_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
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Re: talking handheld

[Ari Moisio]

Hi!

  Have you though of simputer, www.simputer.org. Only problems so far it
has only touch-screen and can talk only indian languages but is runnin
LInux so these symptoms may be cured:-)


-- 
Mr. Ari Moisio, Niittykatu 5, 41160 Tikkakoski
gsm: +358-40-5055239, icq: 164241561

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 234 bytes --]

They make thumb jeyboards as anaccessoriey for all palms. I use the graffitie 
input it comes with. 

I dont know the name of the program from dragin systems, but it allows voice 
input and voice output on a windows c e device.

jeff

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 350 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Rafael Skodlar,,,]

The keyboard is as tiny as it can get to be usable. 7 X 3 cm (3 X 1.5
"). The keys are close but usable with an avergae hand, whatever that
means.

The keyboard layout is qwerty (at least for US market) with Fn
(function) key to multiply the functionality of each key. Space bar is
the longest in the middle of the bottom row with function keys and
Enter.

To access the console you need to install software for it then it's a
matter of clicking a few times from lower left corner. I would think
that it's possible to assign one of the function keys to whatever
program at the bottom of PDA. It would be very easy to start any program
including consloe that way. Of course you would lose one of the default
asigned functions for a particuar key. There are 7 push button keys and
a special 4 way key for moving cursor around.

Another thing I like about is it's Suspend mode for low power mode so
you don't need to reboot each time you want to use it. A simple numeric  
password can be used to provide some security.

You run it as root user in default mode but you can add users. I haven't
tried to use it as a regular user yet. Can't do everything is short time
but then it would be too simple if it were so.

I'll look around for sound applications to see what can be done for
speech if I have time over the weekend.

Rafael

On Fri, Aug 23, 2002 at 06:54:45PM -0400, Mike Gorse wrote:
> How large is the keyboard on the Zaurus, and how usable is it?  And is it
> complicated to get access to a console?
> 
>  And prices have definitely come down a little since the last time I looked;
> according to pricewatch they can be had for around $350 including shipping.
> 
> This thread comes up every few months, and there is nothing technical
> stopping anyone from buying a Zaurus and adapting it.  We have all the
> software that we'd need to get speech.  I'd probably buy one if I had the
> money, although it would be nice to actually look at one first.
> 
> -- Michael Gorse / AIM:linvortex / http://mgorse.home.dhs.org --

Re: talking handheld

[Mike Gorse]

How large is the keyboard on the Zaurus, and how usable is it?  And is it
complicated to get access to a console?

 And prices have definitely come down a little since the last time I looked;
according to pricewatch they can be had for around $350 including shipping.

This thread comes up every few months, and there is nothing technical
stopping anyone from buying a Zaurus and adapting it.  We have all the
software that we'd need to get speech.  I'd probably buy one if I had the
money, although it would be nice to actually look at one first.

-- Michael Gorse / AIM:linvortex / http://mgorse.home.dhs.org --

Re: talking handheld

[Rafael Skodlar,,,]

I'm not visualy impaired, just trying to help a bit here and there.

The device, Sharp Zaurus, has a tiny keyboard for input, I assume there
is a way to attach larger keyboard, but you can use pickboard, unicode,
and handwriting which is probably not suitable for visualy impaired
without audio output. Some innovative company could come out with
attachments assisting visualy or otherwise impaired people.

I forgot to mention it only cost me $299 for the PDA itself on sale. You
can pay the same for mini MP3 player that has only one function, ply
music.  Wireless cards go for around $130. Prices might come down from
the current street price of about $450.

My current internal memory usage: 32MB total, 21 MB Used, 11 MB
available. Since flash memory is getting unbelievably cheap it's not
hard to decide to buy additional storage for user applications and data.
I've seen 128 MB CF memory for less than $80 on sale. With that kind of
storage and hepufuly sufficient CPU power one could run text to speech
programs.

Since the OS is open source I'm sure one could port many programs from
other platforms to run in Zaurus. Dependig on memory and CPU usage,
speech programs should be no exception.

Only (?) 20 years ago I used to work on mainframe computers that had
less memory, CPU was way slower, and data storage, i.e. disk drives
stored only about 40 MB per disk pack. Oh, and the only sound was noise
from huge motors and fans.

Rafael

On Fri, Aug 23, 2002 at 03:07:56PM -0400, rick watson wrote:
> This sounds like we are headed in the right direction.
> Are you visually impaired and if so, how do you access the device.
> 
> thanks
> 
> Rick
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rafael Skodlar,,, [mailto:raffi@linwin.com]
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 3:11 PM
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> 
> 
> I bought Sharp Zaurus PDA device at last Linux world expo in San
> Francisco. I'm very pleased with it and it's the most promising PDA in
> my opinion. Briefly, it has 64 MB of main memory, CF port, memory stick
> port, cradle port, sound input and output, tiny keyboard, and infrared
> port. Cradle port can be used for serial or USB type of connections.
> 
> I haven't used sound on it yet but it's possible to play mp3 files which
> makes me think that one should be able to install software that
> generates sound output. It's possible to use audio input from microphone
> or whatever other source to record into file. Sound output works with
> headphones and can be connected to amplifier with speakers. Sound demo
> at the tradeshow was impressive.
> 
> Besides original OS, one can overwrite it with openZaurus, which
> excludes commercial software like Opera (web browser) and office tools.
> Open source of course provides many of the tools we enjoy in other
> versions of Linux or Unix.
> 
> I downloaded programs like console which gives me access to bash and
> other GNU tools. Having wireless card inserted in CF port (compact flash
> memory) I can connect to wireless network to get email, browse the
> internet, etc. I haven't tried lynx yeat but have no dubt it works as
> expected. Another important tool I use is openssh.
> 
> Backups are simple, Zaurus creates tar file on CF card that can be dealt
> with on any Linux desktop. Files can easily be transfered between the
> machines using CF card. I haven't tried memory stick yet but assume it
> works just like CF does.
> 
> In short, I recommend Sharp's Zaurus for it's flexibility, support for
> open source, and computing power. It's graphical part of software could
> be removed to gain memory space for the blind specific tools. Perhaps
> some kind of speech generating software could be installed on it. Ever
> growing density of CF memory makes it possible to keep bigger and bigger
> files in PDAs. If I come across anything like that I'll let you know.
> 
> I keep a list of Zaurus related links on
> http://www.linwin.com/zaurus/index.html
> 
> Rafael
> 
> On Fri, Aug 23, 2002 at 08:17:13AM -0400, rick watson wrote:
> > Hi Everyone,
> > 
> > I am comfortable using linux on a server. I have installed the speakup
> > package.
> > 
> > After briefly looking at the blinux archive, it appears that some of you
> are
> > experimenting with handheld devices.
> > 
> > I am interested in getting a handheld which talks. Could you please
> provide
> > experiences. I realize that this will most likely involve installing
> > software. This should be no problem. I want to have some good ideas before
> I
> > invest money in a handheld.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Good or BAD experiences are welcome!!
> > 
> > thanks
> > 
> > Rick
> 
> 

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1060 bytes --]

Rick, I use 123 fonts, x master and teal magnify. I use the largest bold 
font. Sometimes I use a program to invert the screen or reverse the disaplay. 
I use it for reading news and info from websites by avantgo the night before, 
websites relating to my college classes, outlines and notes. I like it 
because its smaller then a laptop and does the same thing, well except speech 
or a 36 point font. I also use the handwriting feature for entering info as 
well as the computer. I take it with me when I travel and use a home made 
modem or the modem adapter for going online. 

Its almost tempting to buy a windows CE device and a copy of that dragon 
program that makes it wireless so to speak in the sense it uses speech input 
and output thanks to that program. I went with palm because its cheaper and 
so far its works for me. 

The first I would like is a simle text to speech app for reading long emails 
or copy paste text. You know, like what those first sound cards came with for 
PCs. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1145 bytes --]

RE: talking handheld

[rick watson]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1317 bytes --]

Hi Jeff,
 
I can't use it in the same way you would. What program from dragon??
 
rick
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Mail4cobb@aol.com [mailto:Mail4cobb@aol.com]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 3:50 PM
To: blinux-list@redhat.com
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Rick, I use 123 fonts, x master and teal magnify. I use the largest bold
font. Sometimes I use a program to invert the screen or reverse the
disaplay. I use it for reading news and info from websites by avantgo the
night before, websites relating to my college classes, outlines and notes. I
like it because its smaller then a laptop and does the same thing, well
except speech or a 36 point font. I also use the handwriting feature for
entering info as well as the computer. I take it with me when I travel and
use a home made modem or the modem adapter for going online. 

Its almost tempting to buy a windows CE device and a copy of that dragon
program that makes it wireless so to speak in the sense it uses speech input
and output thanks to that program. I went with palm because its cheaper and
so far its works for me. 

The first I would like is a simle text to speech app for reading long emails
or copy paste text. You know, like what those first sound cards came with
for PCs. 

Jeff 

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org 
Richmond, Va 


[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 2388 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 213 bytes --]

I am aware that linux kits exist to over write the os on your current palm, 
but I want one with sound and possibility text to speech and a lower price. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 293 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 845 bytes --]

I am not too fond of them either. I start with version 1 of JFW on up and the 
only answer to my solution was to blame Windows or tell me to increase the 
swap file. No refund was allowed, so since I already invested taht much had 
to upgrade and more then once too. 

I didnt mean to boast their product, I am interested in a linux P D A for the 
blind or low vision. I dont know enough about programming either to do it 
myself. I would want a way to increase the font, bold it and still not loose 
much from the screen. Second would be a magnifier like zoom text in operation 
that allowed you to look around the screen or point and scribble while it 
followed you. I have teal magnify but its a look only app, then you have to 
turn it off and do what it was you were going to do. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 925 bytes --]

RE: talking handheld

[rick watson]

This sounds like we are headed in the right direction.
Are you visually impaired and if so, how do you access the device.

thanks

Rick


-----Original Message-----
From: Rafael Skodlar,,, [mailto:raffi@linwin.com]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 3:11 PM
To: blinux-list@redhat.com
Subject: Re: talking handheld


I bought Sharp Zaurus PDA device at last Linux world expo in San
Francisco. I'm very pleased with it and it's the most promising PDA in
my opinion. Briefly, it has 64 MB of main memory, CF port, memory stick
port, cradle port, sound input and output, tiny keyboard, and infrared
port. Cradle port can be used for serial or USB type of connections.

I haven't used sound on it yet but it's possible to play mp3 files which
makes me think that one should be able to install software that
generates sound output. It's possible to use audio input from microphone
or whatever other source to record into file. Sound output works with
headphones and can be connected to amplifier with speakers. Sound demo
at the tradeshow was impressive.

Besides original OS, one can overwrite it with openZaurus, which
excludes commercial software like Opera (web browser) and office tools.
Open source of course provides many of the tools we enjoy in other
versions of Linux or Unix.

I downloaded programs like console which gives me access to bash and
other GNU tools. Having wireless card inserted in CF port (compact flash
memory) I can connect to wireless network to get email, browse the
internet, etc. I haven't tried lynx yeat but have no dubt it works as
expected. Another important tool I use is openssh.

Backups are simple, Zaurus creates tar file on CF card that can be dealt
with on any Linux desktop. Files can easily be transfered between the
machines using CF card. I haven't tried memory stick yet but assume it
works just like CF does.

In short, I recommend Sharp's Zaurus for it's flexibility, support for
open source, and computing power. It's graphical part of software could
be removed to gain memory space for the blind specific tools. Perhaps
some kind of speech generating software could be installed on it. Ever
growing density of CF memory makes it possible to keep bigger and bigger
files in PDAs. If I come across anything like that I'll let you know.

I keep a list of Zaurus related links on
http://www.linwin.com/zaurus/index.html

Rafael

On Fri, Aug 23, 2002 at 08:17:13AM -0400, rick watson wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I am comfortable using linux on a server. I have installed the speakup
> package.
> 
> After briefly looking at the blinux archive, it appears that some of you
are
> experimenting with handheld devices.
> 
> I am interested in getting a handheld which talks. Could you please
provide
> experiences. I realize that this will most likely involve installing
> software. This should be no problem. I want to have some good ideas before
I
> invest money in a handheld.
> 
> 
> 
> Good or BAD experiences are welcome!!
> 
> thanks
> 
> Rick



_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list

Re: talking handheld

[Marshall F. Scott]

Hi,
Until text to speech is included in more consumer products; these things will
always be expensive.   Have you checked out the Parrot Voicemate?  I think the
URL is <http://voice-assistant.com>
Marshall
--
Marshall F. Scott
University of Utah
CVRTI
95 South 2000 East
Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
Voice: (801) 587-9523
FAX: (801) 581-3128
Cellular: (801) 232-5316

----------
>From: rick watson <rick@oglevee.com>
>To: "'blinux-list@redhat.com'" <blinux-list@redhat.com>
>Subject: RE: talking handheld
>Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 12:23 PM
>

> Hi,
>
> I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the pacmate is
> over 2000 dollars.
> This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.
>
> I am a jaws user and love the program.
> so this isn't a message to bash fs.
>
> rick
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>
>
> Hello,
> Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They
> recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp business
> practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They
> refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the
> money I paid for the contract.
> John
> On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott
> wrote:
>
>> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information on
> this
>> machine.
>> Marshall>
>> --
>> Marshall F. Scott
>> University of Utah
>> CVRTI
>> 95 South 2000 East
>> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
>> Voice: (801) 587-9523
>> FAX: (801) 581-3128
>> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
>>
>> ----------
>> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
>> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
>> Subject: Re: talking handheld
>> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
>>
>>
>> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
> speech
>> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
> wirelessly
>> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose to
> make a
>> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
> Suppose to
>> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
>> Richmond, Va
>>
>
> --
> Computers to Help People, Inc.
> http://www.chpi.org
> 825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list

Re: talking handheld

[John J. Boyer]

Hello,
Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They 
recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp business 
practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They 
refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the 
money I paid for the contract.
John
On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott 
wrote:

> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information on this
> machine.
> Marshall>
> --
> Marshall F. Scott
> University of Utah
> CVRTI
> 95 South 2000 East
> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
> 
> ----------
> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
> 
> 
> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a speech
> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used wirelessly
> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose to make a
> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year. Suppose to
> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
> 
> Jeff
> 
> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
> Richmond, Va 
> 

-- 
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703

RE: talking handheld

[rick watson]

Hi,

I checked it out and the release is this fall. The price for the pacmate is
over 2000 dollars.
This seems much higher than traditional handheld devices.

I am a jaws user and love the program.
so this isn't a message to bash fs.

rick

-----Original Message-----
From: John J. Boyer [mailto:director@chpi.org]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 2:29 PM
To: blinux-list@redhat.com
Subject: Re: talking handheld


Hello,
Be very careful about any dealings with Freedom Scientific. They 
recently had a management shakeup, but they are known for sharp business 
practices and insensitivity to their customers. I should know. They 
refused to honor a service contract, and then they wouldn't return the 
money I paid for the contract.
John
On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Marshall F. Scott 
wrote:

> Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information on
this
> machine.
> Marshall>
> --
> Marshall F. Scott
> University of Utah
> CVRTI
> 95 South 2000 East
> Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
> Voice: (801) 587-9523
> FAX: (801) 581-3128
> Cellular: (801) 232-5316
> 
> ----------
> From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: talking handheld
> Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM
> 
> 
> Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a
speech
> input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used
wirelessly
> with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose to
make a
> talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year.
Suppose to
> be identical in features with other palms and use same software.
> 
> Jeff
> 
> http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
> Richmond, Va 
> 

-- 
Computers to Help People, Inc.
http://www.chpi.org
825 East Johnson; Madison, WI 53703




_______________________________________________
Blinux-list mailing list
Blinux-list@redhat.com
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list

Re: talking handheld

[Marshall F. Scott]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 829 bytes --]

Check out <http://www.freedomscientif.com>  They have some information on this
machine.
Marshall>
--
Marshall F. Scott
University of Utah
CVRTI
95 South 2000 East
Salt Lake City, UT 84112-5000
Voice: (801) 587-9523
FAX: (801) 581-3128
Cellular: (801) 232-5316

----------
From: Mail4cobb@aol.com
To: blinux-list@redhat.com
Subject: Re: talking handheld
Date: Fri, Aug 23, 2002, 10:44 AM


Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a speech
input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used wirelessly
with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is suppose to make a
talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later this year. Suppose to
be identical in features with other palms and use same software.

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va 

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1163 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 444 bytes --]

Oh, sorry, hit send too soon. I believe the dragon people have made a speech 
input and output package for the windows ce devices. It can be used 
wirelessly with voice. Lastly henter and joyce or freedom scientific is 
suppose to make a talking blind windows ce device. Suppose to release later 
this year. Suppose to be identical in features with other palms and use same 
software.

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 520 bytes --]

Re: talking handheld

[Mail4cobb]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 516 bytes --]

Ive read about several companies releasing linux hand helds like the palm 
pilot, but they dont speak or use any of the existing software. They are dirt 
cheap, include software for a pc, but lack apps. I use a palm with a font 
hack and tealmagnify. I have 2, a reflective one for outside and bright areas 
and a 3c which is back lit for indoors and low light. I use them for reading 
material like scanned books, material from websites and appointments. 

Jeff

http://www.wheelchairmodifications.org
Richmond, Va

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