Youtube TV Site?

Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Hi All: I understand Google has a $35 monthly subscription to a TV service. So 
first I tried
www.youtubetv.com
I only receive 1 link of a frame, which provides a blank page. w3m won't even 
load it, but all other console browsers just have this frame. If I visit 
youtube, around link 17 says something along the lines of get youtube tv or 1 
month free trial. The link at a bottom is
https://tv.youtube.com/?utm_source=youtube_web&utm_medium=ep&utm_campaign=home&ve=34273
Exactly same results. I even took a look on my Apple TV to see if they had an 
app, other than standard youtube. I certainly would love to see a list of 
channels, especially live news. What would I get which I cannot already stream 
or grab? You would think Google would make its sites alot more friendly. Thanks 
so much in advance
Chime

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Youtube TV unfortunately is limited only to about 5 cities at this time. 
I'm hoping more come soon, as that $35 subscription has the potential to 
include the most channels for the price. If you happen to be in one of 
the cities that can get Youtube TV, your channel lineup would be as follows:
ABC
CBS
Fox
NBC
CW
Telemundo
ESPN
Comcast RSN
Fox RSN
FS1
AMC
USA
FX
Freeform
Disney
ESPN2
ESPNU
FS2
Big10 Network
SEC Network
E!
Bravo
Oxygen
IFC
FXX
ESPNEWS
NBCSN
NBC Universo
Golf Channel
MSNBC
Fox News
CNBC
BBC America
Fox Business
Sundance TV
National Geographic
NatGeo Wild
WeTV
Disney XD
Disney Jr.
Sprout
Sci-fi
Chiller
FXM
Universal

In addition, there were about 4 logos that had no alt text, so I'm not 
sure what those channels are, and I'm unfortunately not in an area where 
I can get Youtube TV at this time, so I have no way of getting the month 
trial to see exactly what those are. In any case, I hope this helps a 
little, and yes, I do wish tv.youtube.com would become more speech 
friendly in the future, as I had to get those from Chromium. Firefox 
didn't even read the logo alt text for the channels I listed.
~Kyle

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

also from what I can tell direct tv now and the sling tv apps are not 
blind friendly on phone nor pc or anything last I checked.

I have heard good things about youtube tv but itr is not in my area either.
thanks
Hank

On 6/21/2017 9:24 PM, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:
> Youtube TV unfortunately is limited only to about 5 cities at this 
> time. I'm hoping more come soon, as that $35 subscription has the 
> potential to include the most channels for the price. If you happen to 
> be in one of the cities that can get Youtube TV, your channel lineup 
> would be as follows:
> ABC
> CBS
> Fox
> NBC
> CW
> Telemundo
> ESPN
> Comcast RSN
> Fox RSN
> FS1
> AMC
> USA
> FX
> Freeform
> Disney
> ESPN2
> ESPNU
> FS2
> Big10 Network
> SEC Network
> E!
> Bravo
> Oxygen
> IFC
> FXX
> ESPNEWS
> NBCSN
> NBC Universo
> Golf Channel
> MSNBC
> Fox News
> CNBC
> BBC America
> Fox Business
> Sundance TV
> National Geographic
> NatGeo Wild
> WeTV
> Disney XD
> Disney Jr.
> Sprout
> Sci-fi
> Chiller
> FXM
> Universal
>
> In addition, there were about 4 logos that had no alt text, so I'm not 
> sure what those channels are, and I'm unfortunately not in an area 
> where I can get Youtube TV at this time, so I have no way of getting 
> the month trial to see exactly what those are. In any case, I hope 
> this helps a little, and yes, I do wish tv.youtube.com would become 
> more speech friendly in the future, as I had to get those from 
> Chromium. Firefox didn't even read the logo alt text for the channels 
> I listed.
> ~Kyle
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

First of all, thank you Kyle for the list. 2nd, Hank, supposedly Direct TV Now 
has a good app on an Apple TV 4th Generation, but for myself neither of these 
offer anything I can't get with Dish Network or Uverse, as I thrive on News 
channels. Thank you both once again
Chime

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Okay, so if you're in a rural area, this doesn't apply to you.

On Thu, 22 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2017 00:24:19
> From: Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list@redhat.com>
> To: blinux-list@redhat.com
> Subject: Re: Youtube TV Site?
> 
> Youtube TV unfortunately is limited only to about 5 cities at this time. I'm 
> hoping more come soon, as that $35 subscription has the potential to include 
> the most channels for the price. If you happen to be in one of the cities 
> that can get Youtube TV, your channel lineup would be as follows:
> ABC
> CBS
> Fox
> NBC
> CW
> Telemundo
> ESPN
> Comcast RSN
> Fox RSN
> FS1
> AMC
> USA
> FX
> Freeform
> Disney
> ESPN2
> ESPNU
> FS2
> Big10 Network
> SEC Network
> E!
> Bravo
> Oxygen
> IFC
> FXX
> ESPNEWS
> NBCSN
> NBC Universo
> Golf Channel
> MSNBC
> Fox News
> CNBC
> BBC America
> Fox Business
> Sundance TV
> National Geographic
> NatGeo Wild
> WeTV
> Disney XD
> Disney Jr.
> Sprout
> Sci-fi
> Chiller
> FXM
> Universal
>
> In addition, there were about 4 logos that had no alt text, so I'm not sure 
> what those channels are, and I'm unfortunately not in an area where I can get 
> Youtube TV at this time, so I have no way of getting the month trial to see 
> exactly what those are. In any case, I hope this helps a little, and yes, I 
> do wish tv.youtube.com would become more speech friendly in the future, as I 
> had to get those from Chromium. Firefox didn't even read the logo alt text 
> for the channels I listed.
> ~Kyle
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>

-- 

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

While it's true that DirecTVNow isn't exactly the most user friendly app 
on either a phone or a Roku device, I can get it to work on both, 
although I did need to use Chromium for the initial signup process, as I 
couldn't even get to the signup page in Firefox without getting a "WHAT 
THE DEUCE" unsupported browser message. Chromium gave me the same 
message whenever I tried to watch something, but I still was able to 
sign up using it.

Having tried Sling, Playstation Vue, DirecTVNow and TikiLive on both 
Android and Roku devices, and having also tried Hulu with live TV on 
Android, I would say that Sling offers the best access on both Android 
and Roku by far, as it is quite accessible and fairly easy to use on 
both devices. Hulu is a fairly close second on Android, but doesn't run 
on Roku yet, although this is "coming soon" according to their list of 
supported devices. Both PlayStation Vue and DirecTVNow  are mostly 
usable on the Roku devices, but the interfaces are a bit less intuitive 
than Sling. On Android, DirecTVNow works, but refuses to cast to a 
Chromecast, and the guide will only tell me what's on, not what channel 
it's on, whereas the Roku will allow me to see a grid of channels, but 
won't tell me what's on them. Playstation Vue is the worst of the lot on 
Android, as not only did I have problems navigating in the guide, but I 
also could find no cast button, even with the latest Android and Google 
Home app. On the other hand, it's clearly my second choice for 
accessibility on Roku devices, and its channel lineup seems more 
comprehensive at the high end than Sling with its far superior UX but 
slightly less comprehensive channel lineup. At the high end though, 
Sling just may beat out PS Vue, although I didn't try the highest 
package with all the extras to see what I would get. For now, I have a 1 
month trial of DirecTVNow that will expire in just under a month, and I 
watch TikiLive's free channels, of which there are many, although few if 
any of those are cable channels. However, cable channels are available 
from TikiLive at a cost of $30/month, and this seems to include a lineup 
that is similar to Youtube TV's offering, but it's available anywhere in 
the US. Hope at least some of this information helps.
~Kyle

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Thanks for your comparisons, didn't see a name? Since you have a ROKU, as I do, 
are you also noticing youtube and CNN have little or no speech? When I phoned 
ROKU about these channels, they said the vender controlls that. I wish there 
were, or maybe there are communities where Blind users discuss accessibility of 
the service? I find quality of ROKU speech to be better than orriginal, but 
still somewhat muffled, and seemingly no way of hearing single letters. On the 
plus side, I think streams are much more stable than Apple TV.
Chime

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Just saw the news comment. For a really good news experience, you may 
want to get Pluto TV. Although it works better on Android/Chromecast 
than it does on a Roku device, it does have a lot of news channels, 
including Newsy, SkyNews, Bloomberg, Cheddar, top stories of the day, 
NewsMax, RT America, The Young Turks, news from MSNBC/CNBC, and more, 
all free forever, and you can take it with you everywhere you go. It 
also has a rather extensive selection of other fully free channels. On 
my Roku, I find I have to channel surf, as the guide doesn't speak for 
some reason, but on Android, it's about the most user friendly TV app 
available. TikiLive is another option, as even their free package 
includes a good selection of news channels, but on mobile devices, it 
does indeed work, but it doesn't seem quite as easy as Pluto.
~Kyle

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Thanks Kyle: I have played with Pluto on Apple TV 4th Generation, quite 
inconsistant, whether it will read or track a highlighted channel.
On a wider scale, more-and-more sites, such as youtubetv also beenvarified dot 
com   all I get in Lynx is a single frame through google tag manager. Thanks 
from
Chime

Re: Youtube TV Site?

[Linux for blind general discussion]

I didn't try CNN, since I get it on every provider I've tried thus far. 
I did however notice that Youtube does indeed have no speech on the 
Roku. I haven't contacted them about this yet, but I did contact Crackle 
today about the fact that their app also has no speech. Out of all my 
tests, I have found that Crackle, Youtube, Pluto TV, Newson, Pandora, 
Weather Nation and another weather app have little to no speech. There's 
also Timeless Television, which seems to just play ads, so I'm not sure 
how to make it speak, or if it does. All that said, 5 or 6 out of nearly 
60 I've tried in total isn't bad at all, since that would give Roku 
devices an accessibility rating of nearly 90%, which is really quite 
good, though it's just as unscientific as anything, since it's only 
based on the channels I've been interested in trying.
~Kyle

Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

I'm not currently aware of any community, forum, e-mail list, Facebook 
group, etc. where blind and visually impaired users can come together to 
discuss Roku device accessibility. I'll look for such a beast further, 
and if I find it, I'll report back on this thread. If not, I'll start 
one, as too many people are under the misconception that Roku devices 
are not accessible at all, or that Roku accessibility is abysmal at 
best, when in fact the voice is my only real complaint. Well, that and 
the 6 apps that I found that didn't speak or didn't speak well. Until I 
have something conclusive or make a list or similar available, I did 
find this.
https://support.roku.com/article/223737947-channel-contact-list
It doesn't have everything, nor does it cover all the channels I've 
mentioned previously that don't have speech, but it's a good start. I 
found contact pages for both Crackle and Pandora on this page, and have 
sent both of them messages regarding the lack of speech in their channel 
apps, including links to
https://support.roku.com/article/231584647-how-do-i-use-audio-guide-
the introduction to the audio guide and how it works, and to
https://sdkdocs.roku.com/display/sdkdoc/roAudioGuide
Audio Guide SDK documentation for channel developers who need the Audio 
Guide to speak custom messages, either because they're using custom 
controls that are unsupported or because they need the Audio Guide to 
speak additional information that is not supported using the default 
functionality of the Audio Guide in relation to the control used. 
Hopefully this will help somewhat.
~Kyle

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Well Kyle, thanks in advance for your efforts. Those first 2 links endup at a 
ROKU site with just 4 links, including that dredded google tag manager and a 
javascript warning, so from what I've seen, unless I look on 3rd party sites, I 
cannot even find an adequate channel list on an actual ROKU site. Also, there 
seems no specific guide written for blind consumers. O-and-reason I wanted to 
try CNN is to watch CNN International, also grab some archived shows to a Book 
Port, but like many of these channels, an activation page is quite a challenge.
Chime

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Well, I should note that text based browsers are usually no longer 
considered when trying to develop accessible websites, so your mileage 
will vary greatly when using a text-based browser, even when a site can 
be accessed with no trouble using Firefox, Seamonkey or Chromium. For 
example, whereas you had problems accessing the links I posted earlier, 
I had no trouble at all accessing them in Firefox. I would copy and 
paste the information from the channel contact list I posted, but this 
relies on having a link to the contact or support page for each channel 
listed, and once you get there, even if I was to be able to copy and 
paste each link, the contact or support page will likely be unfriendly 
to text only browsers, as they don't adhere to current HTML standards. 
Sorry for the trouble, it's just the way even the w3c handles things now 
as far as I can tell.

After doing a rather thorough search for Roku accessibility groups or 
blind Roku users, I find only a single post on a blind tech list that 
refers to what would appear to be an early model Streaming Stick 
available at Walmart last year. So I'll likely start an e-mail list or 
similar. Thoughts are welcome, i.e. should this be specific to Roku 
devices for the most part, or should it cover all accessible TV devices 
including the latest cable box offerings? In answering this question, it 
is important to note that the Chromecast and Android TV devices are on 
topic on the eyes-free Android list, and the Apple TV is on topic on 
AppleVis. About the only thing I can think of at this point that isn't 
covered elsewhere is the Amazon Fire TV line, including the Fire TV 
Stick, the Fire TV box and the up and coming Fire TV with Alexa, the one 
that's a complete TV that is said to be released in the coming months, 
not the device that connects to an existing TV. Of course there are also 
the LG and Samsung TV's that have accessibility built into their high 
end models, and they are also not covered anywhere as far as I know, 
although they have varying levels of accessibility and different methods 
of accessing screen reader/audible guide features. In any case, if a 
general accessible TV list is most desirable, then a general accessible 
TV list it will be, although that will quickly go all over the map, so 
may be harder to manage, since too many devices with too much variation 
in features and methods of access could become problematic.

The next question would be the format. Is it to be an e-mail list, a 
forum, a group on a social media platform, ...? What type of moderation, 
if any, do we want? Should it be a strictly on topic list or group, or 
should it be very loose and relaxed? Just some starter thoughts. Feel 
free to answer any questions or ask questions of your own.
~Kyle

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Well Kyle, since I am usually only in a console, other than edbrowse, only 
choices I have are Lynx type browsers.
As far as a newer list, there is a list called "Blind Internet TV" moderated by 
a Comcast employee who helps with their speech. Although I think this list may 
have more subscribers than his.
Chime

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Hmm interesting regarding the blind internet TV list. But since that's 
moderated by a Comcast employee, wouldn't it mostly just cover speech on 
Comcast's boxes? Of course it may go into the Xfinity Roku channel to a 
point, but I'm not sure that's where I would take discussions of Roku 
devices, not to mention Amazon Fire TV and other devices that don't have 
Xfinity TV apps as far as I know.
~Kyle

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Well Kyle, I think he is David Goldfield? His list is not through his Comcast 
work. I would suggest writing him-and-figure out among you both, which are the 
best list options. I think I only have a posting address, which I would only 
send you alone
Chime

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Hmmm. That name does somehow sound familiar. Did he blog or podcast or 
something regarding accessibility? Not necessarily for a TV device, but 
for a tablet, phone, something? Yes, do send me the post address, and I 
should be able to figure out the subscribe/owner/whatever from that. 
Kyle 4 Jesus [at] g-mail [dog] com. Run it all together, make it all 
lowercase and remove symbols and such; I modified it extensively to 
fight harvesters.
~Kyle

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

May i ask when wacg 2.0 changed to reflect your point?
The success criteria requires a site to support all current and future 
tools.  Lynx is current as of what two weeks ago?
Links, and e-links are not actually text based, just text friendly.
If developers are excluding populations, many in countries where Internet 
bondage is an issue use them as well, it is perhaps  because of plug & 
play blind person concepts. those perpetuated, more often than not, by 
those  who feel that  all blind people are the same using the  same tools.
Chimes, let me go back and look at where Paul is sending you.
Karen


On Thu, 22 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> Well, I should note that text based browsers are usually no longer considered 
> when trying to develop accessible websites, so your mileage will vary greatly 
> when using a text-based browser, even when a site can be accessed with no 
> trouble using Firefox, Seamonkey or Chromium. For example, whereas you had 
> problems accessing the links I posted earlier, I had no trouble at all 
> accessing them in Firefox. I would copy and paste the information from the 
> channel contact list I posted, but this relies on having a link to the 
> contact or support page for each channel listed, and once you get there, even 
> if I was to be able to copy and paste each link, the contact or support page 
> will likely be unfriendly to text only browsers, as they don't adhere to 
> current HTML standards. Sorry for the trouble, it's just the way even the w3c 
> handles things now as far as I can tell.
>
> After doing a rather thorough search for Roku accessibility groups or blind 
> Roku users, I find only a single post on a blind tech list that refers to 
> what would appear to be an early model Streaming Stick available at Walmart 
> last year. So I'll likely start an e-mail list or similar. Thoughts are 
> welcome, i.e. should this be specific to Roku devices for the most part, or 
> should it cover all accessible TV devices including the latest cable box 
> offerings? In answering this question, it is important to note that the 
> Chromecast and Android TV devices are on topic on the eyes-free Android list, 
> and the Apple TV is on topic on AppleVis. About the only thing I can think of 
> at this point that isn't covered elsewhere is the Amazon Fire TV line, 
> including the Fire TV Stick, the Fire TV box and the up and coming Fire TV 
> with Alexa, the one that's a complete TV that is said to be released in the 
> coming months, not the device that connects to an existing TV. Of course 
> there are also the LG and Samsung TV's that have accessibility built into 
> their high end models, and they are also not covered anywhere as far as I 
> know, although they have varying levels of accessibility and different 
> methods of accessing screen reader/audible guide features. In any case, if a 
> general accessible TV list is most desirable, then a general accessible TV 
> list it will be, although that will quickly go all over the map, so may be 
> harder to manage, since too many devices with too much variation in features 
> and methods of access could become problematic.
>
> The next question would be the format. Is it to be an e-mail list, a forum, a 
> group on a social media platform, ...? What type of moderation, if any, do we 
> want? Should it be a strictly on topic list or group, or should it be very 
> loose and relaxed? Just some starter thoughts. Feel free to answer any 
> questions or ask questions of your own.
> ~ Kyle
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Okay,
try this
1-855-213-4314
That number comes from this   site
www.rukotechnicalsupport.com
I used links the chain, and it does reach a human.
I did not dig around much the phone number is at the top of the page.
hope it helps,
Karen

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Considering how hit or miss websites are when it comes to ease of
blind use even in a browser as mainstream and feature rich(arguably to
the point of excess) as Firefox, I'm inclined to believe most
webmasters have made no effort to ensure accessibility and that when a
website is fully accessible, it's as often by accident as by design. I
doubt the average creator of webpages even knows that browsers like
elinks and lynx even exist or even takes the time to ensure there
pages load as intended in mainstream graphical browsers other than the
one they use themselves.

That said, from what I've tried, I'd have to say currently available
console web browsers leave much to be desired, with even sites that
have never given me problems in Firefox sometimes being unusable in
text-mode browsers assuming I can even figure out how to point the
text-mode browser at a given URl. It's a real shame that even the best
text browsers seem so limited compared to their graphical cousins,
especially since Firefox is the only reason I ever launch an Xsession.

-- 
Sincerely,

Jeffery Wright
President Emeritus, Nu Nu Chapter, Phi Theta Kappa.
Former Secretary, Student Government Association, College of the Albemarle.

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

There is no such thing as most developers.  Regardless those doing 
business in global jurisdictions where wacg 2.0 is incorporated  into 
legal requirements might find themselves in trouble.
Now, if a web designer remembers what the word cascading style sheets 
means, your inability to point might not  reflect what i s possible in a 
truly configured low graphics environment.
Or so that has been my personal experience.
I can say absolutely firmly that personal applies to me...which is the 
case for each individual.
Karen


On Fri, 23 Jun 2017, Linux for blind general discussion wrote:

> Considering how hit or miss websites are when it comes to ease of
> blind use even in a browser as mainstream and feature rich(arguably to
> the point of excess) as Firefox, I'm inclined to believe most
> webmasters have made no effort to ensure accessibility and that when a
> website is fully accessible, it's as often by accident as by design. I
> doubt the average creator of webpages even knows that browsers like
> elinks and lynx even exist or even takes the time to ensure there
> pages load as intended in mainstream graphical browsers other than the
> one they use themselves.
>
> That said, from what I've tried, I'd have to say currently available
> console web browsers leave much to be desired, with even sites that
> have never given me problems in Firefox sometimes being unusable in
> text-mode browsers assuming I can even figure out how to point the
> text-mode browser at a given URl. It's a real shame that even the best
> text browsers seem so limited compared to their graphical cousins,
> especially since Firefox is the only reason I ever launch an Xsession.
>
> -- 
> Sincerely,
>
> Jeffery Wright
> President Emeritus, Nu Nu Chapter, Phi Theta Kappa.
> Former Secretary, Student Government Association, College of the Albemarle.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Blinux-list mailing list
> Blinux-list@redhat.com
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
>

Re: Roku accessibility (was Re: Youtube TV Site?)

[Linux for blind general discussion]

Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list@redhat.com> writes:

> Hmmm. That name does somehow sound familiar. Did he blog or podcast or
> something regarding accessibility?

Yeah, David Goldfield used to work for Blazie Engineering.  I remember
that name from my days as a BNS user.  I think he used to do some of
their audio cassette tutorials back in the day.  It's funny how I can
remember a random factoid like this from more than twenty years ago.

-- Chris