From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from int-mx1.corp.redhat.com (int-mx1.corp.redhat.com [172.16.52.254]) by listman.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D5DA40E21 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:50:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mail@localhost) by int-mx1.corp.redhat.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g944okj11452 for blinux-list@listman.redhat.com; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:50:46 -0400 Received: from mx1.redhat.com (mx1.redhat.com [172.16.48.31]) by int-mx1.corp.redhat.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g944okf11447 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:50:46 -0400 Received: from clubdepot.com (mail.qostar.com [65.120.171.0]) by mx1.redhat.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g944Vd021128 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:31:39 -0400 Received: from dalek [65.238.31.183] by clubdepot.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.06) id AD50A6D00EE; Fri, 04 Oct 2002 00:47:12 -0400 Received: from davros by dalek with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17xKOe-0003gw-00 for ; Fri, 04 Oct 2002 00:49:04 -0400 Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:49:03 -0400 From: Buddy Brannan To: blinux-list@redhat.com Subject: Re: RedHat and accessibility Message-ID: <20021004044903.GA14150@dalek> References: <20021004035841.GA13700@dalek> <000601c26b5e$cc24d920$0201a8c0@NU7I> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <000601c26b5e$cc24d920$0201a8c0@NU7I> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Declude-Sender: davros@clubdepot.com [65.238.31.183] X-Declude-Spoolname: D1d500a6d00ee5a01.SMD X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by QoStar Services for viruses. X-Note: Please report abuse to abuse@clubdepot.com X-Loop: blinux-list@redhat.com Sender: blinux-list-admin@redhat.com Errors-To: blinux-list-admin@redhat.com X-BeenThere: blinux-list@redhat.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: blinux-list@redhat.com X-Reply-To: Buddy Brannan List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Linux for blind general discussion List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 09:30:36PM -0700, Darrell Shandrow wrote: > Hi Buddy, > > Well, since I intend no piracy, I have no trouble signing NDAs, as long as > it means I will indeed gain the access I need. Doesn't make them any less evil. If you believe in the free software concept...what is piracy? What, we're not allowed to share? (See speeches by RMS...we could argue about this till the cows come home.) While I will use what I have to in order to get useful work done (even if that means using something proprietary), I will *always* use a free alternative over a proprietary one, or even an open alternative over a proprietary one. I will, in short, use proprietary software only when I cannot get useful work done because a usable free alternative is not currently available. I just signed one for Sybex > 3 days ago to get the MS Word version of their CCNA Study Guide... EGADS! Two evil things in one go!!!! Don't they have their text in something that's, oh, I dunno, not a proprietary standard?! Jeez. ... The world is a-changing...and for the better, IMO...as more free software gets into the main stream. (harrumpf) I take a > very reasonable approach; I'll do anything that is reasonable as long as the > company in question is working with me cooperatively towards accessibility. Define reasonable. For that matter, define unreasonable in a similar context. I'd say Jason's case was about as unreasonable as it gets. Now is signing a NDA in order to get study material reasonable? Would you have to sign such an agreement in order to get hardcopy print? After all, you could easily enough run the thing off on a copier and share it with your friends, couldn't you? What's the diff? And what exactly are the restrictions? > But, in Jason's case, it seems RedHat was actually trying to take steps to > actively interfere with a blind person's progress in his life as a human > being, let alone a qualified Linux tech. Hmmm, how to effectively teach > RedHat a useful lesson in access that will result in positive > change? Here, I think we can agree. Someone's got the wrong idea. Again...this is a different world, and I think RH (insofar as the suits in charge of certification, docs, training, whatever are concerned) heeds to understand this. This > was a pretty aggregious example to me. Even Microsoft is better than RedHat > here!!! ...which should really tell us something, folks. > > Hmmm, one idea... Maybe we should start with RedHat corporate management > staff? If we get no results, start a letter-writing campaign to all the > authors and teams who created all the various open-source packages RedHat > provides in order to explain how RedHat is violating open-source principles > and acting in a detrimental manner towards a subsection of its customers and > users? Maybe. While I appreciate Redhat's moves in the right direction insofar as accessibility goes, I think I'll keep using Debian. :) -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV/3 | "And if the ground yawned, Phone: (814) 455-7333 | I'd step to the side and say, Email: davros@ycardz.com | "Hey ground! I'm nobody's lunch!" http://www.ycardz.com/ | --Eddie From Ohio